Southern 'LC' fall rotation

[Baker]

I learned a lot studying the LC mixes and experimenting with them. As with all things ag the species and timing vary based on location. I will start planting my southern interpretation of the fall LC mix planting from mid Sept thru mid Oct. moisture considered.

I have my big fields currently planted in a mix of soy beans, cow peas, sunflower and sunn hemp. There also is some volunteer radishes. With all the moisture this summer everything has done great. In fact as soon as it dries out a bit [ hopefully next week ] I'm going to mow the fields as high as my mower deck will allow out of concern I can't drill directly into the fields as thick as they are. Let some of the material decompose .

This is my version of the fall LC rotation all planted with a no till drill at the same time directly into standing crops. Rates per acre:
100 lbs elbon rye
50 lbs. wheat
15 lbs crimson ...if required. Most of my fields are seeded from previous yrs crimson
3 lbs daikon radishes
1 lb purple top turnips

Usually get a blush of soybean sprouts from summer crop which helps a bit also.

 

[cutman]

Thanks for reposting this. Do you mind including your drill settings? I'm going to plant something very similar but maybe add some oats and arrowleaf clover.

Do you ever include vetch or is that planted at a different time of year?

 

[Baker]

I'll get the settings for you.

Oats will work well I just have better luck with wheat here. Since I double crop this rotation with peas/beans in the summer arrowleaf won't work cause it lasts longer into the summer. I like it though and have a bit scattered around.

We plant joint vetch or aeschynomene in the spring. { Never planted hairy vetch as I don't think it does well here } Joint vetch is a fantastic deer food lasting from mid summer to freeze. I mix it 50/50 with alyce clover. It's where most of my deer are now with clovers dormant and most things rangy from summer.

Another mix I use a lot in the fall is:
50 lbs wheat
6 lbs Durana
5 lbs red clover
3lbs radishes
Usually add a couple lbs chicory as it works well with this combo
Sometimes add a little crimson say 5 lbs so as to not choke the other clovers.
I use this mix to establish perennial clovers.

 

[cutman]

Thanks. I'm going to change my philosophy a little bit moving forward as far as plots are concerned. I'm going to do about 6 acres of peas/beans per year, 5 acres of corn, and the rest in a modified version of LC mix like you posted above. Some of the fields will be mowed to release the clover, and others I will leave the rye standing for cover.

 

[Brian]

Oats will work well I just have better luck with wheat here.

Baker- if I remember correctly, we're from the same area (I live in Baton Rouge and my property is in Wilkinson Co., Miss.) and I was hoping you could elaborate on the differences you've seen between wheat and oats in this area.

I usually plant a mix of about 55-60# each of wheat and oats plus 3# of brassicas (rape and radishes). Although my plots have generally produced well, I've never been able to distinguish between the wheat and oats to tell if one was doing better than the other! I was even thinking of planting one half of a field in wheat and the other half in oats as a test this year... but if you could share a little experience and wisdom maybe I can skip the testing!

 

[Baker]

I'm in Pineville. Hope the flooding wasn't an issue for you in Baton Rouge. Rough stuff.

Oats have never done as well for me as wheat or rye. They turn red, have poorer germination, and just aren't as robust. Might be my soil as it can stay quite damp thru much of winter / spring. I like the broad leaf of the oats [ a fatter leaf that wheat or rye ]and would plant it in a mix if it worked better. Easiest way to tell performance is wait for spring when they start seeding out. If equal planting rates it should show when bolting. In the mixes I see no preference one small grain over the other though the conventional wisdom is oats are preferred. frankly I don't think it matters. Grow what works best.

Radishes do very well for me and are heavily grazed. Turnips not so much though I keep growing them for soil and the grazing they do get. I haven't had good success with rape. Doesn't grow well here.

Hope this helps

 

[Btaylor]

We are going with Crimson, arrow leaf, and ladino clovers, rye, sunflower, hairy vetch and radish this weekend. Oh and 2T of chicken litter per acre to feed da seed.

 

[dogdoc]

My fall planting this year is a mix wheat, rye, oats, rape, daikon radishes, and sunflowers.

 

[Semisane]

Mine is wheat, oats, chicory, Chickasaw Ladino clover and sunflowers. I used that mix last fall for the first time and it worked out great. The deer cleaned the sunflower off early and hit the wheat and oats all winter. The clover and chicory came on strong in the spring. They wiped out most of the chicory by the end of may and are still on the clover. A rainy spring and summer were a great help.

 

[dgallow]

Baker....why do you use 150 lbs of rye+wheat?

We use 70-80 lb elbon rye+trticale with 10-15 lb bob oat....not over 90 lb total small grains.

You ever try black oats?
https://greencoverseed.com/species/1059

 

[Triple C]

Radishes do very well for me and are heavily grazed. Turnips not so much though I keep growing them for soil and the grazing they do get. I haven't had good success with rape. Doesn't grow well here.

Same on our place. Deer prefer radishes over any other brassica. Love the LC Mix. Easy to do and it works. Favorite set up is to plant the LC mix in interior and white clover around the perimeter with rye as a nurse crop for the clover. With ample summer rain, the clover stand just keeps putting out without going dormant. Lots of pics of deer in clover during summer months.

 

[cutman]

I think I'm going to go with:

100 lb rye
50 lb oats
10 lb Crimson clover
10 lb arrowleaf clover
2 lb chicory
3 lb radish

This will be per acre planted with no till drill. Will aim to plant early October weather permitting. For some fields this will be basically a cover crop to be terminated in March to plant corn, other fields will be left undisturbed until next fall, and other fields will be mowed in spring to release the clover.

 

[Rickey]

Cutman,
You don't think that seeding rate is a little high? I'm about to plant 1-1/2 acre with 100 Abuzzi Rye, 50 oats, 10 red clover, 5 white clover, and a few pounds of some type of brassica, haven't decided. Is that to thin?

 

[cutman]

I'm honestly not sure, Rickey. It's probably high for some parts of the country, but I plan on no tilling it into some pretty thick vegetation so I'm counting on less than 100% germination. I also want to crowd out worsening nutsedge next spring.

I based my rate on Baker's posted rate, but I'm certainly willing to listen if the consensus is that I'm crazy.

 

[Rickey]

I don't think you're crazy. I've only been planting a few years myself. I'm just trying to learn. You are fighting the same battle as me since we are so close and may have the same soil types. I am doing throw and mow this year and you are no till. I would love to no till but I just can't justify the cost for deer and small acreage. I'm planning on sending the better half to e feed and seed next week, I might as well get some more grain.

 

[swat1018]

I plant about 90# oats and 75# rye to the acre, with some MRC, GHR, and usually peas or leftover beans. You aren't too heavy. I no-till also.

 

[srmtrap]

What does LC stand for?

 

[dogdoc]

What does LC stand for?

Lickcreek = LC.

He was a member of the other forum that was very generous with all his information. He shared all his seed mixes and rates. He passed away a couple of years ago. His name is Paul Knox and you will find a dedicated room just to him that contains several of his threads. Check them out - they are great reads.

 

[srmtrap]

Thank you

 

[Baker]

Baker....why do you use 150 lbs of rye+wheat?

We use 70-80 lb elbon rye+trticale with 10-15 lb bob oat....not over 90 lb total small grains.

You ever try black oats?
https://greencoverseed.com/species/1059

This is a recipe I've used for several years. I 'think' I got the mix from the LC mix from previous site though I did modify it for my region. I thought it heavy initially as well but it has worked well with all cultivars growing effectively. In the bigger fields the radishes survive annihilation and seed and resprout in the spring. The mix certainly puts lots of growth on in the spring and creates lots of thatch. Still no problem drilling summer mix in.

I've never tried black oats. Never heard of them. Advantages? I use the wheat as much to give another small grain profile for the soil as anything.