Triple C's Place

Loved the walkway/firepit. And the thinning coming on great with growth. Question: Are the pines you see planted on most tree plantations in the south native type pines, or are they chosen for plantings for future harvest and have replaced the "native" pines and savanahs that once was prevalent in southern forests? I always wonder this as I drive the country down there. And if they are not the natives, then do they function as well with forest structure as the originals? And were there more prevalent hardwood type forests thruout the south in its virgin days? Just curious.
 
Loved the walkway/firepit. And the thinning coming on great with growth. Question: Are the pines you see planted on most tree plantations in the south native type pines, or are they chosen for plantings for future harvest and have replaced the "native" pines and savanahs that once was prevalent in southern forests? I always wonder this as I drive the country down there. And if they are not the natives, then do they function as well with forest structure as the originals? And were there more prevalent hardwood type forests thruout the south in its virgin days? Just curious.

dogghr - There are so many varieties of pines in the south depending on latitude. The ones you see in the pine plantations are mostly comprised of loblolly in the piedmont section of the state, say just north of Atlanta down to Macon. In the southern part of the state loblolly is still widely planted along with slash pine and long leaf pine. These varieties are native but have been genetically modified to producer faster and straighter growth. Long leaf is making a huge comeback in desirability and can withstand fire at a much younger age than loblolly. Normally, loblolly is not prescribed burned until after the 1st thinning which is usually around 16 to 18 yrs in stand age. From what I understand, a long-leaf pine can withstand fire at pretty much any age. Long leaf pine produces a much longer needle and is very desirable for pine straw. It also is slower growing that loblolly and produces a denser wood. It is what you see if you ever visit one of the quail plantations in South Georgia. Stately trees that have a longer growing cycle than loblolly and often times, burned every year. There are a number of programs to help landowners establish long leaf pine even in my area but mostly farther south. Topsoil is relatively poor down here due to deforestation in the 19th and early 20th century during the cotton era. Pretty much eroded much of the topsoil. Loblolly and many species of pine will flourish in poorer soil conditions. If you cleared an acre of land just about anywhere down here, loblolly would immediately establish due to wide seed dispersion along with the hated sweet gum. If you did nothing to it, over the course of 50 years or so the pines would die out and be overtaken by hardwoods with a dispersion of pines throughout.

Much of the land around where my farm is located was owned by timber or paper companies throughout the 60s and up until the early 2000s. Thus, much of the land was planted in loblolly plantations. With the increase in land prices, much of this land was sold and the timber companies simply purchased the timber from the landowner at time of harvest. My farm was owned by a timber company and was planted by them. I'm the beneficiary of their plantings. Today, most of the land is owned by individuals with a pretty good emphasis on growing trees.

Tenured Student can offer much more insight into this subject since his education is in forestry. Perhaps he will weigh in if he reads this.
 
dogghr - There are so many varieties of pines in the south depending on latitude. The ones you see in the pine plantations are mostly comprised of loblolly in the piedmont section of the state, say just north of Atlanta down to Macon. In the southern part of the state loblolly is still widely planted along with slash pine and long leaf pine. These varieties are native but have been genetically modified to producer faster and straighter growth. Long leaf is making a huge comeback in desirability and can withstand fire at a much younger age than loblolly. Normally, loblolly is not prescribed burned until after the 1st thinning which is usually around 16 to 18 yrs in stand age. From what I understand, a long-leaf pine can withstand fire at pretty much any age. Long leaf pine produces a much longer needle and is very desirable for pine straw. It also is slower growing that loblolly and produces a denser wood. It is what you see if you ever visit one of the quail plantations in South Georgia. Stately trees that have a longer growing cycle than loblolly and often times, burned every year. There are a number of programs to help landowners establish long leaf pine even in my area but mostly farther south. Topsoil is relatively poor down here due to deforestation in the 19th and early 20th century during the cotton era. Pretty much eroded much of the topsoil. Loblolly and many species of pine will flourish in poorer soil conditions. If you cleared an acre of land just about anywhere down here, loblolly would immediately establish due to wide seed dispersion along with the hated sweet gum. If you did nothing to it, over the course of 50 years or so the pines would die out and be overtaken by hardwoods with a dispersion of pines throughout.

Much of the land around where my farm is located was owned by timber or paper companies throughout the 60s and up until the early 2000s. Thus, much of the land was planted in loblolly plantations. With the increase in land prices, much of this land was sold and the timber companies simply purchased the timber from the landowner at time of harvest. My farm was owned by a timber company and was planted by them. I'm the beneficiary of their plantings. Today, most of the land is owned by individuals with a pretty good emphasis on growing trees.

Tenured Student can offer much more insight into this subject since his education is in forestry. Perhaps he will weigh in if he reads this.

You are spot on Triple C. The main reason lob is favored is due to the fact that it responds to silvicultural treatments well- fertilization, thinning, spraying, etc... I have burned stands as young as 10- takes very favorable conditions to do so.

On the wildlife side- a pine plantation, some imazapyr, and a drip torch can make habitat like Mozart made music! That's all I got to say bout that.

Long leaf is making a huge comeback thanks to LLA and other state/federal cooperatives. I love long leaf . It produce great wood and long leaf ecosystem is one the most diverse in the world.
There is also some conversation about short leaf restoration. Short leaf is a Piedmont species while LL and slash are coastal.

The reason most timber company lands are nonexistent is due to tax laws . TRA 1986 provided the catalyst to this.



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Triple C - I love the pics of thinned pine tree stands with plenty of cover and food. BTW - where did you source the wax myrtle seedlings from? Now that my LL have grown up, I need a new screen. :D
 
Triple C - I love the pics of thinned pine tree stands with plenty of cover and food. BTW - where did you source the wax myrtle seedlings from? Now that my LL have grown up, I need a new screen. :D

Call your local GFC office. I just checked their online site and didn't see any wax leaf myrtle offered. I've ordered twice from then but last time was in 2013.
 
You are spot on Triple C. The main reason lob is favored is due to the fact that it responds to silvicultural treatments well- fertilization, thinning, spraying, etc... I have burned stands as young as 10- takes very favorable conditions to do so.

On the wildlife side- a pine plantation, some imazapyr, and a drip torch can make habitat like Mozart made music! That's all I got to say bout that.

Long leaf is making a huge comeback thanks to LLA and other state/federal cooperatives. I love long leaf . It produce great wood and long leaf ecosystem is one the most diverse in the world.
There is also some conversation about short leaf restoration. Short leaf is a Piedmont species while LL and slash are coastal.

The reason most timber company lands are nonexistent is due to tax laws . TRA 1986 provided the catalyst to this.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

TS...Thanks for additional insight!
 
I get the feeling that our state forestry department and nursery really want us to get rid of loblolly pines and go with all native Shortleaf pines. They are slowly getting rid of anything that wasn't native to Oklahoma...Problem is I love the loblolly pine! I am hoping I can get the Oklahoma nursery loblollies this year because the 200 I got from MDC didn't make it and I have never had that problem with the ones I got from our nursery...
 
I get the feeling that our state forestry department and nursery really want us to get rid of loblolly pines and go with all native Shortleaf pines. They are slowly getting rid of anything that wasn't native to Oklahoma...Problem is I love the loblolly pine! I am hoping I can get the Oklahoma nursery loblollies this year because the 200 I got from MDC didn't make it and I have never had that problem with the ones I got from our nursery...
I've had good years and bad years with MDC pines in general. I think the MDC gets their pines from a vendor. One year I received a call from the MDC asking how my pines were because there had been complaints and they were considering using a different vendor.
 
Triple C, those pines are great for climbing tree stands. I used to climb what I called, "Nose bleed high", where deer couldn't see me or detect my scent. Since leaving the Southeast retired my climbing stand because I can't find a good tree.
 
Call your local GFC office. I just checked their online site and didn't see any wax leaf myrtle offered. I've ordered twice from then but last time was in 2013.

Nativ Nurseries used to offer them in the catalog but were always sold out. I will try the local forestry office and see what they can do for me. If anyone else has knowledge of where one can obtain wax myrtle seedlings, please reply. Thanks.
 
I get the feeling that our state forestry department and nursery really want us to get rid of loblolly pines and go with all native Shortleaf pines. They are slowly getting rid of anything that wasn't native to Oklahoma...Problem is I love the loblolly pine! I am hoping I can get the Oklahoma nursery loblollies this year because the 200 I got from MDC didn't make it and I have never had that problem with the ones I got from our nursery...
Interesting on the loblolly deal. Seems loblolly would flourish in most of OK. They are certainly one fast growing tree. The view in front of my cabin has changed drastically since 2011. We once could see for literally miles and miles but not anymore. But, we are not beginning to be able to see down through the loblolly stand after thinning.
 
Triple C, those pines are great for climbing tree stands. I used to climb what I called, "Nose bleed high", where deer couldn't see me or detect my scent. Since leaving the Southeast retired my climbing stand because I can't find a good tree.
Brush...you are spot on! When climbers first came in fashion in the mid 70s you could climb 10 to 12 ft high and deer would walk right under you. Nowadays...if you're hunting an open pine stand you better climb to nose bleed height! We have a double Millennium ladder stand over the hour glass plot that is only 17 ft tall but it's tucked back in the pines about 30 yds and sitting up on a knoll overlooking the plot. Never been busted in that stand.
 
Nativ Nurseries used to offer them in the catalog but were always sold out. I will try the local forestry office and see what they can do for me. If anyone else has knowledge of where one can obtain wax myrtle seedlings, please reply. Thanks.
Let me know what you find out from the GFC. I really like these plants for screening. They form a bush type shape and grow really fast.
 
really nice thread - really enjoyed reading about the harvests - Also the fire pit is so well done, I'm a huge fan of that - and I love the view from it -
 
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