J-birds place

[j-bird]

Well I was out trying to get some work done today.

I was out today planting some of my sawtooth oaks (thanks to Catscratch). I direct planted some in a few clearings.....I marked there location with red flags - that way I can find them later!!!


Also put some in my small "orchard" in the north. These are direct seeded as well, but I took some additional precautions to hopefully ensure they come it. These cages are temporary - just for germination and I will grow the cages as the trees do.


These are 18" circumference and 18" tall. I decided to close the top to ensure the deer would try to nip the tops off. I put one acorn in the ground and left another on the soil surface. IF I get two to grow I will simply transplant or kill of the smaller of the two.


While I was out I cleaned up some of my chestnuts.....While I was at it it dawned on me how folks ask about cage sizes and the like. These where 3 gallon container trees and the yellow "stick" for reference is 48" long.


I make mine 5 feet tall....I figure that is tall enough - anything that reaches out after that the deer can have.


I make them 3 feet in diameter as well. I try to promote vertical growth instead of outward growth, so if the deer nip off anything that grows beyond the cage.....well long term it's going to get pruned off any way!!!


I also am sure other folks have figured this little trick out as well, but if not I will share as well. The 1x I use to support the cage I sandwich between the overlap of the cage. What this does it allows me to lift the cage up and over the tree to be able to access it while still being rigid enough to keep the cage in place. Works great!

 

[j-bird]

While I was out I saw a few other things I went ahead and took pics of....

This is why neighbors are important.....don't get me wrong I get along with them, but they have no idea or intention of addressing this issue. All the green shrubs you see are jap bush honeysuckle, acres of it.



I was surprised to see how much clover came up where I had planted a brassica mix.....I'm sure the deer are loving it. To be honest I never really considered the benefits before.....but it was a nice surprise.


I also saw some of my apples are waking up as well....


And found that at least something was using my small waterholes!

 

[Chainsaw]

First, I like your little starter seedling cages; they should get the job done nicely.

Secondly, more and more Japanese Honeysuckle bush(H bush) is invading this area as it is evidently in your neighborhood as well. The H bush is still sporadic here on this property and will be kept at bay but to date people around me are generally ignoring it. The buckthorn is bad enough without a second gone wild invasive. Someone whom I respect as very observant tells me the deer browse on the H bush in the spring but I have witnessed zero use of it to date and am checking it regularly. I consider the jury to be still out on that one.

With your neighbor having so much of it, are the deer staying in it for cover during hunting season? Do you see any use for it whatsoever or do you think it is a plant that should be 100% eradicated? I'm certain its presence represents more deer during the winter here than the property can support as it is. It is not so much that there are so many deer area wide here but rather that the area properties are so degraded from past over populations. I'm anticipating that as the surrounding properties use up more and more space growing H bush, that makes those properties even less capable of supporting deer and other wildlife as well. Thus I am beginning to consider this a big issue. Do you think it may be a big issue from what you are seeing in your neighborhood?

 

[j-bird]

What I see of the JBH is it is simply terrible. Yes the deer will use it as cover, but only because it is the ONLY thing in the understory in hose areas. The JBH has choked out everything else. I don't see the deer browse it at all and once the leaves fall off it serves NO purpose at all. I kill every plant I can find and cut and treat with tordon. With the neighbors having it so bad and it's invasive nature it requires management or it will entirely take over with enough sun light. The first pic of it I posted that area had none 10 years ago. The critters brought it from across the road in the second picture. The ONLY natural thing I have seen to control it is a dense canopy which is bad any way.

 

[j-bird]

Had some help today! My youngest (nearly 13) helped with the last of the direct seeded sawtooths. Had several talks about the "how" and "why" of what we were doing. I told her with a little luck maybe in a few years she will shoot a deer coming in to eat an acorn from a tree she is planting. She helped plant acorns, hook up the sprayer and even with filling it. We had to have a talk about why we put the hose down in the tank to reduce foaming........after it was too late!

 

[Chainsaw]

Thank you Jbird for your observations on on the JBH. You have confirmed what I am anticipating. The JBH has just moved from control to ELIMINATE on my property. I'm planning on the last three years of logging to give us a spike on browse left to help slow its advance somewhat while I give it enough attention to kill all the JBH.

You have some great help there; good for you and her and the wildlife! Very nice to see.

 

[j-bird]

Thank you Jbird for your observations on on the JBH. You have confirmed what I am anticipating. The JBH has just moved from control to ELIMINATE on my property. I'm planning on the last three years of logging to give us a spike on browse left to help slow its advance somewhat while I give it enough attention to kill all the JBH.

You have some great help there; good for you and her and the wildlife! Very nice to see.

Thank you. I try to get all my kids outside and the younger the better, some take it and run with it others, not so much. I see it as my job as their father to at least open that door. My other girls like to fish and take pictures outside, but the dirt, bugs and the like...not so much.

You mentioned logging. I won't go into detail here, but logging is what allowed the neighbors place to explode with JBH, It is VERY important to have any invasive under control prior to logging. You don't have to have it entirely gone.....but the less of it you have to start with the less work you will have down the road. The amount of sunlight tends to control the spread of JBH in particular. You start off with some.....open the canopy, disturb the soil and "BOOM" you have a literal explosion of the stuff. It' like you put a cherry bomb in a fresh cow patty.....it's messy....real messy!!! I hunt JBH year round. In the spring it tends to be one of the first shrubs that green up here. Later in the spring the older plants will produce a white or yellow flower like honeysuckle....so I look for that as well. Then in the fall it tends to hold it's leaves later as well as produce a red fruit/berry....so again I use that to track it down. I tend to have at least a pair of hand pruners and a small bottle of tordon with me on the tractor at all times. Some days that is all I do is hunt this crap down, and others it is simply a target of opportunity.....either way only good JBH is dead JBH in my opinion. Others may have different results with it and that is fine.....this is what my experience has been.

 

[OkieKubota]

Great pictures and write up on the direct seeding. I have a literal 5 gallons or so of acorns I need to direct seed. I am going to put a bunch of them over on our new 15 acres of land that attaches to Home 10 but several will be going into our "North Plot" that is going away... Hope to get a few sawtooth and chestnuts this way...

 

[Weasel]

Nice work on the direct seeding. Good luck with the JBH.

 

[Triple C]

Good stuff j-bird! That bush honeysuckle is nasty stuff. I have a lot of the vining Japanese honeysuckle that I consider native on our place. Deer browse it well. When I was a kid, mom and dad built a new house and lined the edge of the yard in bush honeysuckle. That was back in 1965. Stuff is still there.

Always love pics of kids doing habitat stuff. Consider em all memory makers!

 

[catscratch]

Place is looking great and of course very cool that your kids are involved!

Good luck with those Sawtooth. My experience is that they are very easy to grow and you almost can't screw it up. Protection might help that out quite a bit though. I did an experiment last yr. I planted a row of Sawtooth and protected every other one. So far the one's that were not protected are doing fine unless they where in short grass or in the open. The one's in the open have been hammered, the one's in tall grass have been left alone.

 

[Rickey]

I planted 3 sawtooths last year. I did not protect any of them. Lesson learned. The deer ate one down to nothing while the other two are recovering now.

 

[j-bird]

Place is looking great and of course very cool that your kids are involved!

Good luck with those Sawtooth. My experience is that they are very easy to grow and you almost can't screw it up. Protection might help that out quite a bit though. I did an experiment last yr. I planted a row of Sawtooth and protected every other one. So far the one's that were not protected are doing fine unless they where in short grass or in the open. The one's in the open have been hammered, the one's in tall grass have been left alone.

I know I'm taking a chance with those that are unprotected.....but making 100 cages - wasn't in the cards either. If I can get the unprotected ones to sprout I will protect them. I should have float tested them all again....but I didn't. Some where just barely starting to produce a radical. Time will tell and we will see. I live on the place so I will be able to take a look every weekend or even more often if so motivated. Anything become of those paw-paw seed?

 

[catscratch]

I know I'm taking a chance with those that are unprotected.....but making 100 cages - wasn't in the cards either. Anything become of those paw-paw seed?

Experiment all you want. If you need more Sawtooth next yr I can hook you up.
I can't get the damn things to germinate! Not sure if they are slow by nature, I'm doing something wrong, or if they just don't like me. I'll probably direct seed them this weekend and walk away hoping for the best.

 

[j-bird]

Experiment all you want. If you need more Sawtooth next yr I can hook you up.
I can't get the damn things to germinate! Not sure if they are slow by nature, I'm doing something wrong, or if they just don't like me. I'll probably direct seed them this weekend and walk away hoping for the best.

Well I commented on your thread - I have never grown them myself so I am not much help to you.....same on my end....you need or want more paw-paw next year just let me know. Hell, if I can find a way to ship them for a decent price I may dig some up if you prefer to try that route as well. Not sure if they handle that well or not.

 

[Weasel]

Experiment all you want. If you need more Sawtooth next yr I can hook you up.
I can't get the damn things to germinate! Not sure if they are slow by nature, I'm doing something wrong, or if they just don't like me. I'll probably direct seed them this weekend and walk away hoping for the best.

Cat, you can add me to that sawtooth list if you have enough. I can get you all the swamp white, white, pin oak acorns and wild apple seeds you want as trade.

Well I commented on your thread - I have never grown them myself so I am not much help to you.....same on my end....you need or want more paw-paw next year just let me know. Hell, if I can find a way to ship them for a decent price I may dig some up if you prefer to try that route as well. Not sure if they handle that well or not.

J, those paw-paws should ship fine if dug up after the ground thaws and shipped bare root in something that will keep the roots damp. I wouldn't mind trying some of those either if you ever have extra.

 

[catscratch]

You guys are going to have to remind me next fall that you want Sawtooth seed. I'm more than happy to ship seeds and spread the wealth, but that's a long time from now and I'll forget who I told what. It would probably be good to remind me in July so that I can collect when they first start to drop. We can work trades at that point.

J, I really want to get some Pawpaw started. I'm all for trying to ship bareroot if we think it might work. Otherwise another round of seeds would make me happy. Thanks again guys.

 

[anotherdogdown17]

Once they drop this fall, I would love to contribute Bur Oak acorns for anyone looking to trade for these. The acorns would be from oaks native to my property in SE Nebraska. Guessing the trees to be 80-100+ years old...

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

 

[j-bird]

Cat, you can add me to that sawtooth list if you have enough. I can get you all the swamp white, white, pin oak acorns and wild apple seeds you want as trade.



J, those paw-paws should ship fine if dug up after the ground thaws and shipped bare root in something that will keep the roots damp. I wouldn't mind trying some of those either if you ever have extra.

Weasel - if you want some seeds I can get those in the late summer, just let me know.

If I go digging up some saplings at some point I'll try to keep you in mind. I don't know if they are "awake" here or not.....I don't think so. I'll keep my eye out for some and mark them and may dig some for you and Cat come this fall or early spring next year once they go dormant. I don;t mess with them out of my own needs....I got plenty.....you want some....come with a shovel and a bucket and go to town!!! I only mess with them to help others. I could care less for them. I have to find some sort of tube or something to ship them in.....I'll do some investigating.

 

[j-bird]

Just some pics from my walk today.

My Chestnuts are waking up for their 3rd year...I think. I got catkins last year, but no spurs last year. We will see how things go this year.


A walk in the timber looking for sheds and morels.....none of either, but the timber flowers and may apples where there.



Also found some perfect examples of life from a dead tree.....here is a standing dead tree that wood peckers have just beat the crap out of.


I didn't find any morel's but I did find some other mushrooms and fungus. I found some of these....I have no idea what they are....but some where the size of dinner plates!