Fired the Tube and Hired the Cage

[dogghr]

I know it’s ongoing joke/debate about tubes and cages. Personally now I’ve tried both I’d never do tubes again. For one, too much expense compared to a reusable cage. Second, especially for a bushy type tree they don’t allow spreading growth. They get wasp nests, pack full of dead leaves, and weeds can grow within. And finally unlike cages the tubes don’t prevent browsing. Anyone who ever followed my Foodplotting in the Mountains thread, know I am cheap and lazy. I like one and done. No or little maintenance.
Simple. One post. Four or 5 ft fence. Cut 8 ft length. Place around tree. Interweave cut ends. Done. You can wire tie if want. No mulch. Can spray grass occasionally if you want. I don’t. Works w any tree. Your choice.
Did a few pear trees planted last year.

See the browse on this 3yo Silky Dogwood?? Others the deer left alone are 8ft tall. I’m converting all to cages. Wish I took pic after removing tube. Filled w great branches that will spread inall directions creating browse, screening, and propagate more trees via lateral growth.

And btw these Silkies are great for wet areas and are fast growing. I’m standing in 3-5 in water w this pic. Amazing.
I do have Hazelnuts I also originally tuned that I’m setting free. They are in some arid soil.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[jlane35]

I was just debating this same topic this week. I was caging crabapple trees that were originally tubed. It was just an extra step that I felt was a time waster. And 90% of them are browsed just like your picture shows.

I have a whole pile of tubes in the shed bc I bought in bulk that I’m not sure if I will ever use.

 

[Mennoniteman]

Cheap and lazy? Wait, that's me. Maybe that's why I never got on the tube bandwagon. Like you said, cages are reusable, allow the tree to flourish, and work just fine. I get 4' high "Red Top" sheep and goat wire at tractor supply and cut the whole roll to 10'8" lengths which makes a 36" circle, attached to 2- 5' long steel T-stakes pounded into the ground above 14". The only problem with cages is that unless you also have a trunk protector mice and rabbits will chew all the bark off some trees every winter.

 

[dogghr]

I was just debating this same topic this week. I was caging crabapple trees that were originally tubed. It was just an extra step that I felt was a time waster. And 90% of them are browsed just like your picture shows.

I have a whole pile of tubes in the shed bc I bought in bulk that I’m not sure if I will ever use.

Yep I was wondering what I'm doing with mine. Guess I'll put them on Ebay and promote how great they are.
On a side note....I'd give a million dollars if someone can hook me up as to where to buy the reversible zip ties that come with these tubes. Such a great idea but I've not found them anywhere. If I sell the tubes, I'm sure the zips will stay with me!!

 

[jteeen]

Yep I was wondering what I'm doing with mine. Guess I'll put them on Ebay and promote how great they are.
On a side note....I'd give a million dollars if someone can hook me up as to where to buy the reversible zip ties that come with these tubes. Such a great idea but I've not found them anywhere. If I sell the tubes, I'm sure the zips will stay with me!!

I ordered replacement reusable zip ties on amazon.

I like tubes because I rarely have time to spray inside of cages. I have caged apples and they have been fine. However with the quarantine they will have 3 or 4ft of grass inside the cages in another month.

I think growth is about the same. Trees shoot to the top of tubes but then go horizontal for 2 years.



Sent from my LM-G710 using Tapatalk

 

[weekender21]

I tubed and caged a few crab apples as an experiment in 2018. All tubes were removed last summer. No benefit that I could see. I have some tubed oaks and a few tubed cheap pears from Native Nurseries. I don't think it hurts the oaks any.

 

[Native Hunter]

I know it’s ongoing joke/debate about tubes and cages. Personally now I’ve tried both I’d never do tubes again. For one, too much expense compared to a reusable cage. Second, especially for a bushy type tree they don’t allow spreading growth. They get wasp nests, pack full of dead leaves, and weeds can grow within. And finally unlike cages the tubes don’t prevent browsing. Anyone who ever followed my Foodplotting in the Mountains thread, know I am cheap and lazy. I like one and done. No or little maintenance.
Simple. One post. Four or 5 ft fence. Cut 8 ft length. Place around tree. Interweave cut ends. Done. You can wire tie if want. No mulch. Can spray grass occasionally if you want. I don’t. Works w any tree. Your choice.
Did a few pear trees planted last year.

See the browse on this 3yo Silky Dogwood?? Others the deer left alone are 8ft tall. I’m converting all to cages. Wish I took pic after removing tube. Filled w great branches that will spread inall directions creating browse, screening, and propagate more trees via lateral growth.

And btw these Silkies are great for wet areas and are fast growing. I’m standing in 3-5 in water w this pic. Amazing.
I do have Hazelnuts I also originally tuned that I’m setting free. They are in some arid soil.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Welcome to the side of enlightenment

 

[TreeDaddy]

Welcome to the side of enlightenment

dogghr forgot to mention that field mice and fire ants and wasps and birds use tubes for homes

Coons trash tubes in search of wasps

The reported "green house" in the winter becomes a killing sauna in my summer heat

Tubes predispose my fruit trees to all types of scale , fungus and general body rot

not a fan.......

bill

 

[cutman]

I’m with ya. Cages are much better than tubes.

http://deerhunterforum.com/index.php?threads/tubes-vs-cages-update.2466/#post-42623

 

[dogghr]

And one I forgot to mention, is occasionally my bear, probable a young boar marking his stuff, make them toys to drag off and chew on. They are the only thing I've ever had damaged at this farm by them. And how they remove them from the tree baffles me. So if anyone wants some tubes, they are a quarter a piece and 1000$ shipping. Hey, times are hard.

 

[weekender21]

And one I forgot to mention, is occasionally my bear, probable a young boar marking his stuff, make them toys to drag off and chew on. They are the only thing I've ever had damaged at this farm by them. And how they remove them from the tree baffles me. So if anyone wants some tubes, they are a quarter a piece and 1000$ shipping. Hey, times are hard.

I tried giving a few hundred away...no takers.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Cap'n]

Yep I was wondering what I'm doing with mine. Guess I'll put them on Ebay and promote how great they are.
On a side note....I'd give a million dollars if someone can hook me up as to where to buy the reversible zip ties that come with these tubes. Such a great idea but I've not found them anywhere. If I sell the tubes, I'm sure the zips will stay with me!!

The best use of old tubes is to cut them down to short pieces and use them to prevent mice and other critters from chewing the bark.
I hate those zip ties. I prefer aluminum fence wire. Much easier to work with and will far out last plastic.

 

[BoneCrusher20]

Something to be said though about growing from a 12" seedling vs a 3' grafted apple tree.

Seedling has to be in tube to ever survive the mice unless you go with hardware cloth for cage as they are too small for white tree protector yet and need to put something around them. That's my only place I see for a tube as I agree with you i prefer to fence, but every few years I'll get bulk seedlings from our nursery where I need those tubes to get them to fence stage.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[BoneCrusher20]

I know it’s ongoing joke/debate about tubes and cages. Personally now I’ve tried both I’d never do tubes again. For one, too much expense compared to a reusable cage. Second, especially for a bushy type tree they don’t allow spreading growth. They get wasp nests, pack full of dead leaves, and weeds can grow within. And finally unlike cages the tubes don’t prevent browsing. Anyone who ever followed my Foodplotting in the Mountains thread, know I am cheap and lazy. I like one and done. No or little maintenance.
Simple. One post. Four or 5 ft fence. Cut 8 ft length. Place around tree. Interweave cut ends. Done. You can wire tie if want. No mulch. Can spray grass occasionally if you want. I don’t. Works w any tree. Your choice.
Did a few pear trees planted last year.

See the browse on this 3yo Silky Dogwood?? Others the deer left alone are 8ft tall. I’m converting all to cages. Wish I took pic after removing tube. Filled w great branches that will spread inall directions creating browse, screening, and propagate more trees via lateral growth.

And btw these Silkies are great for wet areas and are fast growing. I’m standing in 3-5 in water w this pic. Amazing.
I do have Hazelnuts I also originally tuned that I’m setting free. They are in some arid soil.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Also, something to consider. Instead putting fence right on ground why not get little bigger poles 2-3 of them and elevating your fence to better protect from deer browse level and then trunk protectors on bottom for rabbits/mice. Right now that fence is only stopping rabbits in my experience as anything less than 5' deer will easily reach.

To cut cost I will use chicken wire since im buying few more poles


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[dogghr]

For whatever reason a 4or 5 ft fence keeps my deer from fooling w a tree. I’ve got some apples been n cages for quite a while w no problems. And that 8 ft length which gives maybe a 36” circle has been sufficient. And one stake keeps it n place. Diff areas may need more but I have high dsm. Perhaps I have enough plots and natural browse for them.
Now those tubes trees the deer kept some pruned and others not touched prob dependent on location to their travels.
And my winged and 4 legged predators keep mice and rabbit under control. Never been a problem.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[RLW]

Here is my recipe.

48" 2x4 welded wire
Kencove FiberRod 4'x3/8" -SunGuard - Pointed https://kencove.com/ About $1.50 each
AM Leonard Coco Weed Disk https://www.amleo.com/coco-weed-guards/p/VP-CDXXA/ About $1.00 each


I typically do about 18" diameter cages to get the most out of a roll of wire. My company installs thousands of these thing for forestry, stream, and wetland projects. We even built a large cutter out of angle iron like a paper cutter to cut the wire and built mini post drivers out of black iron pipe to drive the fence rods. The secret is to make your cage slightly smaller then your coco disk, that way you don't need staples to hold it down. The coco disk is natural, so you don't have to ever pull it back up. The coco disk holds moisture and provide some weed control for the first year.

You put down the disk, drive your fence rods through it two wire squares deep (8 inches), roll your wire cage and use the ends to make it round, then weave the cage down over your fence rods. If planting on a a slope put your rods on the down hill side and up hill side. and cut the bottom of the cage on the up hill side so it sits vertical.

 

[j-bird]

I use 5' tall weld wire fence. Normally about a 6' to 8' length. I like narrow cages as I want the tree to grow up and not out. I will only go bigger in diameter if I need to because I bought a larger container tree. I use a T post to anchor it, with weed barrier cloth to cover the ground and some hardware cloth to protect the truck from rodents. I then cover the weed fabric with creek stone/gravel. I have never used a tree tube. I also use hardware cloth to germinate direct seeded stuff as well. I just pinch the top closed to keep critters from being able to reach down into the cage. FLAG AND LABEL ALL OF THE TREES! I don't know how many times I have snagged a cage or forgotten exactly what or when I planted something. A fencing tool is a handy tool to have around for cutting the fence and twisting wire.

 

[KSQ2]

I’ve never tubed fruit trees, but I’ve had good luck with hard wood trees. I buy short tubes that are reusable to use with the small seedlings I get from wildlife group. I’m cheap too, don’t like to spend much for trees, so I buy them small. After a couple years in the tubes I take them off and cage the tree or shrub. If I was purchasing bigger trees, I’d start right off with cages. Hog wire costs a small fortune, but I can sometimes get it cheap a a farm auction.

 

[Oakseeds]

The best use of old tubes is to cut them down to short pieces and use them to prevent mice and other critters from chewing the bark.
I hate those zip ties. I prefer aluminum fence wire. Much easier to work with and will far out last plastic.

I assume you are talking about electric fence wire; really strong, won't rust and easy to use.... great suggestion. For 7-8 bucks, you can purchase over 150' of wire (Ace hardware). Another option I like is copper wire; really easy to use, it's durable and you can easily release it to make modifications. Best of all, it's usually freely (take that literally) available. after a new home is framed out, tradesmen come in to install mechanicals ... plumbers/electricians.
There is usually scrap copper wire - some insulated that is easy to strip - associated with the work of electricians. Some guys will save it to sell for scrap to get lunch money. I have a young fellow who is an excellent diver .... dumpster diver that is. He'll save me a bag once or twice a year; I reward him with a pizza and a case of his favorite beverage. If'n you ain't too proud, you'all can take the plunge.

 

[dogghr]

Quick update to fuel the never ending debate.
Same silky dogwoods. 10 yards apart. Planted same time. Released from prison nearly a year ago. First pic is o e of the three left in its tube. Same results with Hazelnuts. I’ll get pics of them later. Your choice.
#tubesnevermore.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk