Throw N Mow thread...

[Kurt]

Making plans for spring. Have 4 new acres marked off. Those acres are all ungrazed pasture for all of 2021 so quite a bit of thatch available. Going to spray 2-3 times before June 1st, then throw 200 pounds of soybeans per acre on 2 acres and buckwheat on the other 2. Then will see what looks like best time to seed in WR and brassicas for fall food source in the buckwheat planting in August but curious to see what the beans do.

Going to frost seed Kanlow switch into the WR plot I have and then kill the rye before soil temps hit 55 this spring. Don't really know what I am doing but its fun messing around out there. And last falls plot did okay really and that's thanks to the info on this thread.

 

[Elkaddict]

What are your deer numbers like? I’ve seen how quickly deer can decimate a couple acres of beans….

 

[Kurt]

I'd say any given night there are 8-14 deer running around. I'm surrounded by crop fields but thinking the ground south of me is going in corn. Ground to north is currently in winter wheat. I guess worst case if they grind out the bean planting I can go with brassicas and WR in August. Wonder if forage beans would stand up better to heavy grazing pressure.

Thinking I'll end up with 4 acres of WR, awnless wheat, and brassicas going into fall. Plus hoping my Kanlow switch has a good first year.

 

[jlane35]

I'd say any given night there are 8-14 deer running around. I'm surrounded by crop fields but thinking the ground south of me is going in corn. Ground to north is currently in winter wheat. I guess worst case if they grind out the bean planting I can go with brassicas and WR in August. Wonder if forage beans would stand up better to heavy grazing pressure.

Thinking I'll end up with 4 acres of WR, awnless wheat, and brassicas going into fall. Plus hoping my Kanlow switch has a good first year.

I tried 3 acres of beans for 3 years and gave up. It wasn’t worth the time or effort. Now I’m settled on clover, brassica (they normally don’t last the entire season), winter rye, and winter wheat.

 

[Kurt]

I need to get those 5 acres cleaned up a bit so multiple reasons for giving it a shot. I could see ultimately trying to put in a Sainfoin or alfalfa stand in those same acres. It just needs a lot of clean up before I attempt those. I'm also on the extreme western edge of any kind of decent rain moisture so some challenges there as well. If it fails or gets grazed flat, I'll go heavy on WR, awnless wheat and brassicas in August.

Clover is of interest to me as well. I have a long narrow strip of native grass between two long rows of heavy cover. I could probably get 40' wide by 200 yards long in that stretch. Would that be enough clover that the deer couldn't wipe that out? Also, trying to research what types of clover have some drought resistance. Seems like about a half acre back in there. This is what it looks like on one end and that opening wraps back around to the stand my son killed a nice 8 in this year.

 

[catscratch]

I need to get those 5 acres cleaned up a bit so multiple reasons for giving it a shot. I could see ultimately trying to put in a Sainfoin or alfalfa stand in those same acres. It just needs a lot of clean up before I attempt those. I'm also on the extreme western edge of any kind of decent rain moisture so some challenges there as well. If it fails or gets grazed flat, I'll go heavy on WR, awnless wheat and brassicas in August.

Clover is of interest to me as well. I have a long narrow strip of native grass between two long rows of heavy cover. I could probably get 40' wide by 200 yards long in that stretch. Would that be enough clover that the deer couldn't wipe that out? Also, trying to research what types of clover have some drought resistance. Seems like about a half acre back in there. This is what it looks like on one end and that opening wraps back around to the stand my son killed a nice 8 in this year.

I put clovers in everything, even grass. It shares with competition well and deer will pick at it all yr. As far as varieties go I revert to a mix. Med red, arrow leaf, and ladino are my go to's. I have plots in my yard. What I've found in regards to varieties and dry conditions is that some types of clover handle certain conditions better than others but it may change weekly. Plants that were lush a week ago may be dry this week while plants that were wilting last week are lush this week. More diversity the more likely a plant will be there that can flourish in any situation. It's like they take turns leading the race... someone is always strong.

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[Kurt]

Catscratch, Think if a guy started spraying gly in mid June and again in mid July, you could throw and mow 3 varieties of clover and maybe some awnless wheat in mid August or so? Clover is totally new to me but I could see it being a nice draw back in this secluded spot.

If a better way to start it in old pasture, I am all ears on timing and technique.

 

[DocHolladay]

Catscratch, Think if a guy started spraying gly in mid June and again in mid July, you could throw and mow 3 varieties of clover and maybe some awnless wheat in mid August or so? Clover is totally new to me but I could see it being a nice draw back in this secluded spot.

If a better way to start it in old pasture, I am all ears on timing and technique.

Frost seed your clover in February/March and follow up with cleth once it warms up and your “weeds/grasses” start growing. This way, you will have clover popping once it starts to warm up and fawns start dropping. 2-4db will kill more than just grasses and leave the clover, if you want to go that route.

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[Kurt]

Thank you for the advice on that. Going to frost seed Switch so will try a clover plot at the same time.

 

[Mennoniteman]

Frost seed your clover in February/March and follow up with cleth once it warms up and your “weeds/grasses” start growing. This way, you will have clover popping once it starts to warm up and fawns start dropping. 2-4db will kill more than just grasses and leave the clover, if you want to go that route.

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Great advice. Clover is such a fun species to grow, kind of the Swiss army knife of food plot plantings.
Your advice of clethodim and 2,4-DB is spot on, what i wanted to add is that switching herbicides every time you spray makes them way more potent, I'd add Imox and imazethapyr 2sl to that list yet, and also, 2,4-DB is the only herbicide that works for a clover and small grain combination, which makes it a very attractive choice.

 

[catscratch]

Can do what these guys said, or your original plan. The other way I plant clover is with cattle. Just spread seed then feed the herd a few times in that spot. They stomp it in, provide some fert, and set back competition. Can't do it wrong unless you just don't get rain (which I know is a possibility for ya).

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[Mennoniteman]

Can do what these guys said, or or original plan. The other way I plant clover is with cattle. Just spread seed then feed the herd a few times in that spot. They stomp it in, provide some fert, and set back competition. Can't do it wrong unless you just don't get rain (which i know is a possibility for ya).

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I really like that idea, it checks a lot of boxes, and it's got to be hands down the best method there is of starting clover. If you have cattle. I'm a little jealous of your western ranching and beef raising culture, it's a lifestyle that us easterners can only dream about, since most of our good agricultural land is too expensive to use as open rangeland, if someone runs cattle in the east it's usually wide open hills that are too steep for clover, like the rolling hills of Virginia, not close to good deer woods. I'm guessing that in the midwest finding a neighbor who wants to bring their cattle over and graze them for free is a good possibility, however, here in the east with fewer cattle, and even if there if there are cattle available, deer food plots are usually in marginal areas in the woods where there are no fences... But we still enjoy seeing your pictures of the west.

 

[Kurt]

I bought my place just for recreation purposes. I am amazed at the height of the native grasses after just 1 year of no cattle grazing. Nothing against cattle or the cattle industry, just wanting to develop this spot as best I can for wildlife.

Appreciate the great suggestions for various methods of establishing clover. I'll be headed out that way to do some seeding in next 4-6 weeks now.

 

[TX-Aggie]

Our plot have done well this fall and winter. My uncle kept sending pictures to my dad and I showing his plots, commenting about how the plots weren't growing. I kept referring to the exclusion cage, and he wasn't understanding - turns out they didn't put them back last fall when they finished with the throw n mow. My dad was finally able to make the trip to the farm for turkey season (due to work, I was unable to attend, which allowed him to catch up with me on the scoreboard - darn it). Here are some of the plots :

Durana & Patriot Clover Mixture with Rye, Wheat, and Oats (about 1/8" hunting plot, we are looking to expand out to approx 3/4-1 acre this year) :
View attachment 23696

Rye, Wheat, Oats, Clover, Radish, Turnip, and Hairy Vetch Plot (approx 1 acre in size) :

View attachment 23697
View attachment 23698
View attachment 23699

They completed a modified throw n mow last month. They ran the disks oriented straight to make small furrows like a drill would do, then spread the seed. They still want to pulverize the dirt with a tiller, I'm slowly weening them off - the compromise was straight ran disks to let them feel like they "worked" the dirt, without doing too much damage. It was too wet at the time to mow, as the next morning it rained 1.5", followed by 2 days later another 1.5". I am hoping my uncle mowed the plots last week, but haven't gotten an update. We decided to go with a mixture of Green Cover's Summer Release, and Green Cover's Upland Bird mixtures. I hope to make it up in the next month or so, to see how the planting turned out.

Thankfully, my uncle after seeing my dad and mine's 1 acre food plots with clover and grain knee deep instead of bowling alley height (the durana/patriot plot is one of his and example of his plots), he is coming around to expanding his this year, we are trying to get all of them between 3/4-1 acre in size.

They also planted a couple of strips with a short native grass mix alongside the plots, along with native wildflowers and forbs from Johnston Seed (Eastern Monarch Mixture) - cover seed with a couple of summer millets. One is the electrical highline I hunt, and then a sloped area nearby that is too steep for continual planting yearly.

 

[KSQ2]

I'm beginning to wish I hadn't ordered seed. It's never going to rain.
Say it doesn't rain until November, how late can I throw seed and expect it to produce anything? I threw some the first week of October last year because of the drought, can I throw later than that?

 

[jlane35]

I'm beginning to wish I hadn't ordered seed. It's never going to rain.
Say it doesn't rain until November, how late can I throw seed and expect it to produce anything? I threw some the first week of October last year because of the drought, can I throw later than that?

What are you broadcasting?

 

[KSQ2]

What are you broadcasting?

Awnless wheat, rye, clover, radishes, and chicory.

 

[jlane35]

Awnless wheat, rye, clover, radishes, and chicory.

You may not get much radish growth but everything else should take and come back in the Spring.

 

[MarkDarvin]

I'm beginning to wish I hadn't ordered seed. It's never going to rain.
Say it doesn't rain until November, how late can I throw seed and expect it to produce anything? I threw some the first week of October last year because of the drought, can I throw later than that?

What time of year does this dry period typically begin in your area?

 

[KSQ2]

Usually mid to late July. This year it began the first week of June.