Frost seeding chicory?

[KSQ2]

Looks like I threw our money away again this fall when it comes to chicory and clover. Can I frost seed chicory this-coming late winter? I’ve never tried to frost seed it with clover before.

 

[yoderjac]

Looks like I threw our money away again this fall when it comes to chicory and clover. Can I frost seed chicory this-coming late winter? I’ve never tried to frost seed it with clover before.

I find frost seeding works well for overseeding bare spots in existing plots, but doesn't work well to establish a new clover/chicory plot. Perennial clover and chicory, when frost seeded, compete on an equal footing with summer weeds. Perennial clover spends a lot time establishing a root system disadvantaging it compared to summer annual weeds or establish cool season grasses.

My suggestion would be to plant buckwheat in the spring and try again to establish a clover/chicory plot next fall with a winter rye nurse crop. You will spend less time fighting weeds and the plot will last longer before you need to rotate.

But to directly answer your question, yes, you can frost seed chicory with clover.

 

[KSQ2]

I find frost seeding works well for overseeding bare spots in existing plots, but doesn't work well to establish a new clover/chicory plot. Perennial clover and chicory, when frost seeded, compete on an equal footing with summer weeds. Perennial clover spends a lot time establishing a root system disadvantaging it compared to summer annual weeds or establish cool season grasses.

My suggestion would be to plant buckwheat in the spring and try again to establish a clover/chicory plot next fall with a winter rye nurse crop. You will spend less time fighting weeds and the plot will last longer before you need to rotate.

But to directly answer your question, yes, you can frost seed chicory with clover.

I appreciate your advice on the frost seeding and realize fall is better; but I've tried fall 3 years in a row with no success. So the question might become whether or not to completely forget regenerative plotting, forget clover and chicory, and simply work ground and plant cereal grains every fall. They seem to be the only thing that grows with our extreme lack of rain. I do think our climate is changing; I'm not a "greeny", but this 3 year drought is hard to argue with. We are becoming a semi-arid climate, bordering on desert, and it breaks my heart.

 

[yoderjac]

Yes, every area is different and lack of water can be a real issue. Since you are not tilling, you are conserving what moisture your soil does have which is good. I find clover needs rain to germinate, but once germinated, some varieties are reasonably drought tolerant as is chicory. Durana is known for drought tolerance and persistence. I also find the cool nights favor clover germination. I'm in zone 7a and we get ample rain in the fall so summers can be more of a drought period here.

Also, keep in mind that clover seed is hard and will often last until spring. Just one more thought if you decide to try another fall plant. Waiting until you do have a good rain in the forecast before planting may be more important than planting sooner. Frost seeding takes advantage of the heaving and cracking of the soil during the freeze/thaw cycle of early spring. Frost seeding over snow makes seed very visible for birds during a time when food is scarce making seed predation an issue. Since clover surface broadcasts pretty well, especially when cultipacked and the seed is hard and stays viable for many months, I wonder if a fall plant that doesn't germinate is any different than frost seeding functionally.

These are all just things to consider. You know your situation better than I do. I wish you success whatever approach you take.

 

[KSQ2]

Yes, every area is different and lack of water can be a real issue. Since you are not tilling, you are conserving what moisture your soil does have which is good. I find clover needs rain to germinate, but once germinated, some varieties are reasonably drought tolerant as is chicory. Durana is known for drought tolerance and persistence. I also find the cool nights favor clover germination. I'm in zone 7a and we get ample rain in the fall so summers can be more of a drought period here.

Also, keep in mind that clover seed is hard and will often last until spring. Just one more thought if you decide to try another fall plant. Waiting until you do have a good rain in the forecast before planting may be more important than planting sooner. Frost seeding takes advantage of the heaving and cracking of the soil during the freeze/thaw cycle of early spring. Frost seeding over snow makes seed very visible for birds during a time when food is scarce making seed predation an issue. Since clover surface broadcasts pretty well, especially when cultipacked and the seed is hard and stays viable for many months, I wonder if a fall plant that doesn't germinate is any different than frost seeding functionally.

These are all just things to consider. You know your situation better than I do. I wish you success whatever approach you take.

My main worry this year is that it possible germinated with a 1/4” rain we got a couple days after planting and it hasn’t rained since, a month later. And I did till the plots, trying to get a good stand to go back to regenerative plotting. There was simply no subsoil moisture to be lost when I tilled, it was nonexistent.