Thoughts on Dirt management

[David]

I have watched this a few times. There are very few videos on food plots where people are keeping something in the ground all the time, but there are lots of cover crop videos with tons of info. It clicked with these fellas.

VERY INTERESTING VIDEO!

Thanks for posting. Makes me wonder how I can implement this on my few acres of plots.

 

[E_308]

I have watched that video myself a few times over the last few years. I wonder what it would do in areas that typically get rain? I know on my bottom ground you would never get it dry enough to plant with that much residue. Also be interesting to follow the affect on crop disease/pests either positive or negative.

I agree on the small scale for us food plot farmers it is way to go. I haven't tilled a field for a few years. I plan on tilling one this fall just because I need it to double as a firebreak next spring.

 

[David]

It sure looks a lot like throw and mow. wondering if we not only put away the plows, discs, harrows, and chisels....but also the drills and planters one day?

 

[Crimson n' Camo]

It sure looks a lot like throw and mow. wondering if we not only put away the plows, discs, harrows, and chisels....but also the drills and planters one day?

Depends on how much money and acreage you have to plant.......If I had plenty of both then I'd look at getting a drill. If not then I think other options like throw n mow is suitable for many.

 

[dgallow]

This is an interesting read. I was surprised with my trip thru MO OK and TX last yr as to how little no till I saw. Whereas most farms in my area have been no till and covercrops for quite some time. But I think in part the driving force for my area is less ideal soils than the Midwest so it is more profitable and less wasteful of the soil to use here.
I think Midwest in part is spoiled by dgreat soils so like extra money in your pocket you can choose to be less conservative. Or they are jst too stubborn to learn and realize. Not sure.


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There is a sound reason for that.....no major $$ incentive for farmers in most of the US to change tillage practices...that is the bottom line. As example, you will see far more 'rotational grazing' in MO than most other states because local conservation districts subsidize the fence and water infrastructure costs! Other states will do similar incentive as I suspect yours does for no-till.

Some CSP contracts provide aid for cover crops....but not near the 'income' of the two items below.

Crop insurance is a 'welfare' program.

Govt subsidized irrigation is a 'welfare' program.

Most farmers are dependent upon subsidized commodity price, subsidized yield failure, and/or subsidized water. Not anti-irrigation.....but irrigation could be used much more efficiently than is currently done.....starting point looking at improvement of 'soil water infiltration rates and evaporative loss mitigation'.

There is also increasing loss of 'genetic resilience' as new crop varieties develop....plants are bred to resist X,Y and Z pests yet there is loss of A,B and C other resilience genes. The ag industry remains '-cidal'! The more field issues which arise the more we rely on 'technology' to bail us out rather than looking at the true soil and plant related issues.

Insurance is a business....a business which is predatory on farmers....several major companies are now adding 'farm insurance' to the lineup of home and auto.

As commodity prices remain low and input costs high, the majority reaction is to farm lager acreages for the same total net income given less net income per acre (result of increased input costs/ac). OR.....Lord forbid.....one makes a management change which reduces input costs to increase consistency of profitability and net income per acre on small parcels.

South American countries are gaining more market share of world ag commodities, despite our current gov't efforts to increase US ag exports (beef to China as ex). How do they do this? They sell at the same commodity prices we do but pay for inputs at about half our costs.

There will be some major changes in land holdings in the next two decades. Avg farmer age is above 50.....soon we will see the largest transfer of private land holdings as that generation passes and the land is deeded. There is no clear direction for new ownership of that land.....incoming foreign investors is a possibility (like is happening in CA). Some middle aged US farmers are moving to South American countries and setting up new shop there....Why?....same commodity income potential at half the input costs...some of those countries with less political and social issues!

The 'new dust bowl' is here.....just review the news in the western plains the last several years! These are a bit different than the historic dust bowl. The new dust bowl is driven by many more economic, political and social issues. The historic dust bowl of the thirties was driven by sheer ignorance of the ecosystem in that 'the land must be plowed before it can be improved' per ONE govt mandate.....that in fact was a major stipulation for staking homestead land free of 'land cost'!

Is the issue environmental?.....or is it political, economic and social?

Just graze and observe,
Doug

 

[Tap]

I was talking with a farmer a couple of days ago and he said he had just sprayed his notill fields. Spraying cost him a lot more than fuel for disking would have. He justified it due to the soil health advantages he gained... but admitted his inputs (fertilizer and lime) haven't significantly changed since going to notill...
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I wonder if he was doing cover crops? Everything I'm reading these days suggests that planting cover crops really cuts down on fertilizer (mostly N) costs. Lots of other benefits, too. Farmers are starting to plant cover crops the same day as harvest of the cash crop.

 

[catscratch]

I wonder if he was doing cover crops? Everything I'm reading these days suggests that planting cover crops really cuts down on fertilizer (mostly N) costs. Lots of other benefits, too. Farmers are starting to plant cover crops the same day as harvest of the cash crop.

He does plant cover crops but it's a bitter pill to swallow at different times. Cover crop seed costs money and like stated before, spray is more expensive than fuel. He is staying the course because he sees the soil benefits, but cringes when it's time to pay the bills. He's a life long farmer and has succeeded with other practices as things come into and out of popularity. The next best thing is always just around the corner... and marketing promoters can be persuasive. These old farmers are good at finding a way to make things work. Some stay with what they know, others try to make sense of newer ideas and apply them to their land. Either way they don't have many chances to get it right or they loose the place. Banks aren't real forgiving with debt payments...

 

[bigbluetruck]

dgallow, I will agree with you on some points, but disagree on others. I feel one of the biggest hurdles is the learning curve to do anything different. I know it is for us, were small but fairly diverse, corn, alfalfa, breeding cattle and a feedlot. Things arent great but were making it alright, would like to find some more ground but its not easy. There are some things Id like to try, but we cant afford a failure right now, so we will stick with what we know. We do no till for the most part, but not against tillage if its needed either. Cover crops are a good thing I think, and we are starting to incorporate them. But a cover crop where or when it isnt wanted is a weed. Wanted to try interseeding some in our corn but the insurance said no, might try it anyway. I dont particuarly like insurance, but "here" its almost a necessary evil, every year we here are facing a drought, wind, hail or all of them that could result in 0 crops. More than once in my life Ive seen a beautiful field of corn thats 7ft tall reduced to a flat green carpet. So then what? Biggest thing Ive seen help get people into the cover crops and hollistic farming is a small grain cash crop, and "here" its almost impossible, theres no market for it, I think Id have to go at least an hour to get rid of more than a truckload and in our yellow clay, it never seems to grow well enough to justify it.

Irrigation is big here, and I really cant see how we can get much more efficient than a center pivot without spending big $$$$, and without a steady crop price, its not gonna happen. $7 corn didnt do anyone any good, if it would stay in the $4-5 range then everyone could make some money.

Id love to make some changes that will reduce inputs and raise my bottom line, BUT you have to promise me that by doing so, I wont lose any money either. Why do you think few people adopt organics? Its not that they dont want to, its most cant afford the years where you lose yield, but sell it for the same price as regular, until you can get certified and get the price increase that comes with organics.

 

[bigbluetruck]

This is an interesting read. I was surprised with my trip thru MO OK and TX last yr as to how little no till I saw. Whereas most farms in my area have been no till and covercrops for quite some time. But I think in part the driving force for my area is less ideal soils than the Midwest so it is more profitable and less wasteful of the soil to use here.
I think Midwest in part is spoiled by dgreat soils so like extra money in your pocket you can choose to be less conservative. Or they are jst too stubborn to learn and realize. Not sure.


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Actually in some parts of TX they have to till the soil to stop it from blowing, doesnt make sense but Ive seen it. A flat no tilled field will blow like crazy, but if they go in with a big ripper, it acts like mini snow fences and really cuts down on the wind erosion.

 

[dgallow]

dgallow, I will agree with you on some points, but disagree on others. I feel one of the biggest hurdles is the learning curve to do anything different. I know it is for us, were small but fairly diverse, corn, alfalfa, breeding cattle and a feedlot. Things arent great but were making it alright, would like to find some more ground but its not easy. There are some things Id like to try, but we cant afford a failure right now, so we will stick with what we know. We do no till for the most part, but not against tillage if its needed either. Cover crops are a good thing I think, and we are starting to incorporate them. But a cover crop where or when it isnt wanted is a weed. Wanted to try interseeding some in our corn but the insurance said no, might try it anyway. I dont particuarly like insurance, but "here" its almost a necessary evil, every year we here are facing a drought, wind, hail or all of them that could result in 0 crops. More than once in my life Ive seen a beautiful field of corn thats 7ft tall reduced to a flat green carpet. So then what? Biggest thing Ive seen help get people into the cover crops and hollistic farming is a small grain cash crop, and "here" its almost impossible, theres no market for it, I think Id have to go at least an hour to get rid of more than a truckload and in our yellow clay, it never seems to grow well enough to justify it.

Irrigation is big here, and I really cant see how we can get much more efficient than a center pivot without spending big $$$$, and without a steady crop price, its not gonna happen. $7 corn didnt do anyone any good, if it would stay in the $4-5 range then everyone could make some money.

Id love to make some changes that will reduce inputs and raise my bottom line, BUT you have to promise me that by doing so, I wont lose any money either. Why do you think few people adopt organics? Its not that they dont want to, its most cant afford the years where you lose yield, but sell it for the same price as regular, until you can get certified and get the price increase that comes with organics.

I can promise only that some things will not improve unless one's mindset of farm management is changed.....because I have been there....been through the steep learning curves but common sense enough to never risk more than the ranch business could afford to lose! I have been down the consultant road as well....writing out sound soil health plans backed by good soil and plant sampling....watch steps 2 and 3 followed but not step one which cost the least money and had potential for most improvement! Think changing a farmers mind is tough?....try changing a set stocked continuous grazing cattle owners mind! He will spend $1000 per ac on soil amendments and $50 on diesel before spending a nickel on hot wire cross fencing....and the herdsman hates you because all he is looking for is the next living organism which needs to be killed when killing such solves no issue but the blame is all on you! Ranch soil won't become healthier with a cow standing on it 365....and cattle absolutely love to move to new ground...it is same same win win in 2017 as it was in the 1700's when 'rational grazing' was first put down on paper...and much easier with hotwire vs ditches/hedges/stone walls...that is 300years of 'mental oversight'!

There are soil health consultants out there who will partner with you so they have 'skin in the game' as proofing of their recs....check their credentials and employ one!

 

[dgallow]

continued....

Have not sprayed pastures for weeds since 2010...the world as we know it hasn't ended and we've become better forage managers as a result with cattle who utilize more plants in the daily diet than the academics will tell you they can or should....and they ain't died yet and the deer ain't staring either!

The custom grazed herd we managed saw very little management input in terms of animal health provided by that cattle owner.....the world as we know it didn't ended. 2015 was the wettest year on record.....tremendous stress on the whole system....worst case of ovine pinkeye I've ever seen on grass no taller than your boot...the owner and I treated all 102 head that early April. 2016 was 4" under average rainfall....1 calf was treated for pinkeye and we grazed forage as tall as 14 feet....one cow was lame for 2 weeks but healed untreated...other than vaccinate the calves once with 7 way he did nothing else. You would not believe the amount of wives tales I;ve heard orver the last 4 years of planned custom grazing......yet the animals remain in optimal body condition, health is great, and more forage was grown than could be used in the annual cycle! All of that occurred because I took the risk of doing something different against mainstream for the health of our soil and resilience of our forage in 2011....and was allowed to take that risk by the owner of the cattle as long as performance was acceptable...which it was!

For the new cow herd we now own....they get no fly control but my mind is cognizant of those 'black cloud days' which may or may not need organic pyrethrum the next week...hell in a week my spiders will prolly eat most of the flies and the money on fly spray wasted! Herd is only offered 1oz of a certified loose organic mineral once per week....free choice on redmund salt block and a white salt block. The result is a herd which will use about every plant in the pasture as forage while not crammed into stereotypical high density....looking for alternative sources of mineral in all classes of plants....the world hasn't ended and animal health/production is great! Even though the organic mineral is expensive....we've trained the herd to tap into their natural plant resource base to keep the organic cost very reasonable. SO if I want to 'go organic' we could do that....really with no other cost than the membership/inspection fee....or 'go producer certified organic' to skip the fees.....or 'just keep honest accurate detailed records and a transparent operation with open gate' and let the order buyer decide which 'brand name' the calves fit (organic, grass fed, pasture fed etc). I like the last option best since we keep detailed records and I don't incur dues!

We don't need hay rings....a monumental source of animal stress and health issues. We don't need a "Dually with a DOOEZ bed" to feed a cow herd...or a ropin horse and saddle...and don't own a stock trailer. Buckets with lids hold supplement and fit on an ATV and supplement fed either on dry forage or in half cut blue drum portable troughs when it's wet. They herd will follow a bucket like a puppy on a string saving horse care costs! The hay roller I designed will fit any vehicle with a 2" ball so 5x5 bales can be unrolled to ensure the timid cow gets full just as the boss cow does! If I have healthy properly broke calves, the guy who wants them will haul them himself! We choose to cut input costs on things which really are not necessary in a cow calf operation and are often 'over priced' or lose value as 'rust'!

Running a ranch or farm is a business. We forget that. And we forget that both enterprises (at small scale) are best used for supplemental family income not primary income (to a job in town as ex). They guy selling you something is not the best source of advice...and usually not a wise business partner!

Businesses incur risk.....risk management is best handled through enterprise diversity.

Cover crops and crop residues can be grazed....an additional source of revenue per ac...which if the grazing is managed can supersede cash crop revenue while building organic content of fine texture soils at the same time! And let's not talk about soil compaction...my Lord I;ve heard some good ones there!

Cover crops can be grown for seed as a cash crop in a diverse cash crop rotation. There is a large cover crop seed supplier in Bladen Neb who might be interested in your seed.....they import from many other states. You could have a endless cash crop rotation doing that...again lowering risk of reliance solely the big 4 cash crop grains.

I know a guy in NE Neb....his name is Wayne Rasmussen....super nice he and his wife...we met in Dallas at a conference on a bus tour one year. Wayne took risks.....rather than plant corn under that center pivot...he planted diverse forages and grass finishes cattle...his steaks have won awards in Neb....his return per ac on irrigated ground far exceeds corn crop income! What I like about Wayne best is his big heart and generosity.....he has built one of the most important grass fed organizations we have in the US! https://grassfedexchange.com/committee/wayne-Rasmussen

I've never taken a drought relief payment on the ranch! And likely never will need to considering how we manage grazing and the drought management steps which are built into the rotational system. This past year was prime example, the lines were full at FSA for those seeking cool season pasture failure payments. I had the same rainfall and nothing failed...the only money at risk being cover crop seed costs and wear/tear on a $500 1972 drill (which people tell me won't work n not-ill but it hasn't failed yet)....most of the folks in line were locals with plenty opportunity to plan planting at much better timing that I have 160 miles away at a full time job....with better equip then I will ever own (but rust on my stuff don't cost as much)! To compensate for below average rainfall we simply tweaked the rotation to allow longer recovery period on the planted stuff.....all other pastures had plenty 110+d stockpile because we start stockpiling well ahead of what academia suggests....we grazed the brassica portion of mix when it was ready....we grazed 270d+ stockpiled tallgrass rangeland in winter which had a boot tall green component from the long recovery despite dry conditions...we came back to the small grain part of the mix in April....skipping a second winter grazing due to more cloudy days than dry soil! I didn't cry...didn't whine...didn't fret....just remain in faith that the resources which God provided and the understanding of land He has provided would prevail....and they did far beyond our spring expectations. We started the spring rotation earlier than we even had and never looked back! When looking through the pics on my thread....keep in mind all of that started on below average rain and no irrigation!

 

[dgallow]

continued...

My job is in academics....my duties include treating a multitude of high stress bawling feeder cattle who come through local auction markets off ranches with essentially no calf management (ie 70% bulls and stocktrailer weaning)......working right alongside folks who make their living telling producers how to treat sick cattle rather than revamping management for better herd health! That has never made sense to me so I just shut my mouth and do what is needed for a paycheck.....but on the family ranch management is way different and when the calves leave they will be healthy low risk feeder cattle simply because I will spend money and time on proper vaccinations, allow complete castration wound healing, and background wean for 60 days...so some poor Joe won't have to go through the crap I have to on the day job and lose money on a set of calves! And I really feel bad the whole industry has become this way....academics in bed with industry cuz industry (not the state) has research money....so academics pimp products for the company's bottom line not yours (majority of cases)! Pointing some blame at producers....we could do a little better job on cow calf health so that the stocker guy and feeder guy don't have to eat all the costs of treating sick cattle...sometimes the brotherhood ain't so brotherly!

I had a choice in 2011 during that drought.....not change my mind and watch the same thing happen again under static management...watch the soil and forage lose resilience...spend more money/time/sweat on dumb stuff. But I didn't do that.....took full stock in the things which Keith Berns, Gabe Brown, Ray Archuletta, Allen Williams, Cover crop Dave, Walt Davis, RP Cooke, Doug Peterson, Elaine Ingham, Yates Adcock, Ian Mitchell-Innes, Greg Judy, Bill Roberts, Teddy Gentry, etc (long list and I;ve left some out)....all the 'experts and pros' were teaching! That was my insurance policy....to align myself with the 'best in class' of soil health experts...glean bits of wisdom, tactics, and procedures we could adopt and employ on our ranch using our resource base and minimal equipment....and study this soil health stuff real hard (self education)....most all of those folks I shook hands with and looked square in the eye over the last several years....some I call, text or email frequently...some we vacation together. The way I look at it....if my little canoe were going to sink, then it would sink right beside the best armada!

The best things I have ever done from the standpoint of economics, sociality, and enviromentalism is: 1) change the way I see things, and 2) change the grazing plan!

The hardest part of this is first changing your mind about what you have made a livelihood doing for XX years....start with new ideas on small scale at first and work up in acreage (the garden won't fail if you no-till it...it may struggle at first)...always think outside the box..be willing to fail then stand right back up and try similar again.

The first question to answer is "are you willing to forget what you know and change your mind?"....the simplest and least costly thing to do, yet the most difficult! No one can do that for you!

Just graze and observe,
Doug

 

[bigbluetruck]

WOW, alot to read through and digest! Its gonna take me awhile. but to start off with, any ideas where to find one of these soil health consultants?

 

[bigbluetruck]

I was thinking about some of the things you said while out putting mineral to the cows. I do think that this is the way to go to make a small farm/ranch profitable, BUT, one thing that always sticks out on alot of the people Ive tried to learn from, you included is: They always seem to use the farm/ranch as a second job when first starting out. Not many need the income to survive. Not picking on you, it just seems that they either start small and get bigger or can afford a cut in income and go whole hog, not many in between.

Theres an 80 by my parents place, been farmed since the beginning of time, mostly COC since the late 70s when irrigation was put up. But I belive in being flexible, if someone can show me on paper, with more than a "this SHOULD work" that we can make more money than row cropping it, I will do it. But thats the hangup, I havent met anyone who can beat a 200+ yield across the field ( its not all irrigated) thats pretty much a gimme.

I feel like Im between a rock and a hard place, I believe we need to do things differently, but at the end of the day right now Dad still writes the checks. Im the 4th Gen here and weve made it through both the 30s and the 80s farming, and I want my son, whos 4.5 months to have the opportunity to "do what Dad and Grandpa do". Theres alot of weight and pressure that Ive put on myself, because I would never be able to handle being the one who failed at this.

 

[dogghr]

There is a sound reason for that.....no major $$ incentive for farmers in most of the US to change tillage practices...that is the bottom line. As example, you will see far more 'rotational grazing' in MO than most other states because local conservation districts subsidize the fence and water infrastructure costs! Other states will do similar incentive as I suspect yours does for no-till.

Some CSP contracts provide aid for cover crops....but not near the 'income' of the two items below.

Crop insurance is a 'welfare' program.

Govt subsidized irrigation is a 'welfare' program.

Most farmers are dependent upon subsidized commodity price, subsidized yield failure, and/or subsidized water. Not anti-irrigation.....but irrigation could be used much more efficiently than is currently done.....starting point looking at improvement of 'soil water infiltration rates and evaporative loss mitigation'.

There is also increasing loss of 'genetic resilience' as new crop varieties develop....plants are bred to resist X,Y and Z pests yet there is loss of A,B and C other resilience genes. The ag industry remains '-cidal'! The more field issues which arise the more we rely on 'technology' to bail us out rather than looking at the true soil and plant related issues.

Insurance is a business....a business which is predatory on farmers....several major companies are now adding 'farm insurance' to the lineup of home and auto.

As commodity prices remain low and input costs high, the majority reaction is to farm lager acreages for the same total net income given less net income per acre (result of increased input costs/ac). OR.....Lord forbid.....one makes a management change which reduces input costs to increase consistency of profitability and net income per acre on small parcels.

South American countries are gaining more market share of world ag commodities, despite our current gov't efforts to increase US ag exports (beef to China as ex). How do they do this? They sell at the same commodity prices we do but pay for inputs at about half our costs.

There will be some major changes in land holdings in the next two decades. Avg farmer age is above 50.....soon we will see the largest transfer of private land holdings as that generation passes and the land is deeded. There is no clear direction for new ownership of that land.....incoming foreign investors is a possibility (like is happening in CA). Some middle aged US farmers are moving to South American countries and setting up new shop there....Why?....same commodity income potential at half the input costs...some of those countries with less political and social issues!

The 'new dust bowl' is here.....just review the news in the western plains the last several years! These are a bit different than the historic dust bowl. The new dust bowl is driven by many more economic, political and social issues. The historic dust bowl of the thirties was driven by sheer ignorance of the ecosystem in that 'the land must be plowed before it can be improved' per ONE govt mandate.....that in fact was a major stipulation for staking homestead land free of 'land cost'!

Is the issue environmental?.....or is it political, economic and social?

Just graze and observe,
Doug

No argument from me on that list of comments. I think we may be ahead of the curve as my state tends to be on the upper age of the bracket simply from loss of interest of the young in hands on work whether it be farming, mining, or industrial, and they leave for the bigger cities for a decade or two. But now The aging farmer has occurred here and there is an influx in very recent years of a young crowd returning to crop and herd farming. And that crowd tends to be well educated by local universities to newer techniques of crop rotation and no till and they have an interest in return to nature mentality that I haven't seen since the 70's ( kinda sounds like a line from and Eagles song}. Even the county agents around me have no till equipment available for rent.
And I think you know the answer to your last question. And that question pertains to a lot of aspects of our life regardless of occupation.

I do wish you would cease your writings like those that follow this particular post because you are slowly making me want to have cattle again, and I had grown to hate those things and didn't miss them. Not quite there yet but I've been thinking….

 

[dogghr]

Actually in some parts of TX they have to till the soil to stop it from blowing, doesnt make sense but Ive seen it. A flat no tilled field will blow like crazy, but if they go in with a big ripper, it acts like mini snow fences and really cuts down on the wind erosion.

I think even in the back of your mind, you know that is not the best method to manage soil, especially in an arid environment. Just reading your recent posts, I can tell how smart you are, and that down deep you know there is a better way. I won't bore you with my limited knowledge, but I will tell you if you follow the threads on here, you will have and awakening of soil management you didn't know was possible, one that handles in better ways water retention, whether in drought or monsoon. Especially pay close attention to Gallows comments, and the resurgence of a thread by Crimson.
BTW, Nebraska is a beautiful state with some awesome farm land. One of my fav flatland states.
And I will say, while I'm just a pion, that I had the pleasure to walk Gallows ranch, and of all the different farms I have worked since a kid, his was an oasis in a desert. Pretty amazing what he does, and what he does is what he preaches. Some times it is not that we don't know, but its that we don't know we don't know. I think you are about to have an amazing journey, good luck and good to have your knowledge and experience here.

 

[bigbluetruck]

I think even in the back of your mind, you know that is not the best method to manage soil, especially in an arid environment. Just reading your recent posts, I can tell how smart you are, and that down deep you know there is a better way. I won't bore you with my limited knowledge, but I will tell you if you follow the threads on here, you will have and awakening of soil management you didn't know was possible, one that handles in better ways water retention, whether in drought or monsoon. Especially pay close attention to Gallows comments, and the resurgence of a thread by Crimson.
BTW, Nebraska is a beautiful state with some awesome farm land. One of my fav flatland states.
And I will say, while I'm just a pion, that I had the pleasure to walk Gallows ranch, and of all the different farms I have worked since a kid, his was an oasis in a desert. Pretty amazing what he does, and what he does is what he preaches. Some times it is not that we don't know, but its that we don't know we don't know. I think you are about to have an amazing journey, good luck and good to have your knowledge and experience here.

Im not saying its the best way, but Ive seen it and talked to people who live there, at the end of the day they know their soils better than anyone. At the end of the day it should probably be in permenant pasture, theres land here like that, we live not too far south of the begining of the Sandhills and quite often you see land that SHOULDNT be farmed, doesnt mean it CANT, but shouldnt, and unfortunatly theres alot of people who cant see the difference.
I love learning and am always trying to improve everything I have, from the land to a piece of equipment. Both my Dad and I agree there has to be a better way, but finding someone to help guide us and allow us to make as few as mistakes as possible has been extremely difficult.

Im still not sure why everyone thinks Nebraska is flat, ya the Platte Valley is flat as a pancake, but once out of it, very little of it is flat, where we live the tops of hills are flat thanks to glaciers, but everything else is either up, down, or sidways, sometimes all 3 at once lol. Now Indiana and Illinois are flat. IIRC theres more elevation change between the western border of NE and the eastern border than there is from Omaha to the Atlantic ocean or something like that.

 

[Weasel]

Wow, threads like this are what keep me coming back more than any others. I'm just a local government worker with a high school diploma fooling around on 40 acres but I am always looking for better ways to take care of what I am fortunate to have. Thanks to everyone who has participated in this thread.

 

[Jason Broom]

One things threads like this have taught me is that changing the way a food-plotter thinks is relatively easy, because their livelihood is not in question if it takes them two or three tries to get something working right for them. If I try my hand at grafting and they don't take, there's always another tree or another year, but if I'm trying to make a living from an orchard, failure is very expensive! The same is true with ranchers and farmers...they've got to go into something fully understanding the process and the risks involved. With that said, I am firmly convinced that plows are the devil, growing plants the solution, and throw-n-mow or minimal tillage is, by far, the best choice for most food-plotters or farmers.

It's challenging to read the stuff Doug writes, although I try. Maybe some things don't distill down very well, but when someone fairly new to the game looks through a thread like this, it can make their head spin! A lot of the new folks I work with find the learning curve to be daunting; many give up before really experiencing success. That's too bad, because I think the habitat management stuff is more rewarding than the hunting, at this stage in my life.

 

[TreeDaddy]

^^^^^^^ sums up my philosophy as well

Much more fun to work the habitat and more productive when working WITH mother nature

Starting 2nd season throwNmow

bill