Does this make sense?


Active Member
I've got a VERY successful PTT and radish plot, about 40yds x 80 yds. My cams show as many as 13 deer in it at one time. It's pounded like a feed lot and you can't walk though it without getting your boots slippery with deer droppings. All that free fertilizer.... Hmmmmm. I'm thinking it's about time to do some frost seeding. As I can see a lot of bare ground between the turnip remains, I don't think I"m going to have problems with seed/soil contact, especially if I put it down this early. So, I'm thinking a 50/50 mix of ladino and chicory, with the goal of having one or the other becoming a dominant perennial plot. The pH is 5.9 and I'm having it limed in the next couple weeks to boost that into the 6's. Next year's turnip patch will adjoin this one, same size. If the ladino/clover is successful I can simply repeat the process on the second plot the following year - - or go back to the PTT/radish mix into the residual clover.
Secondary question - - can i use cleth on the chicory/ladino plot? I'm not sure of chicory's 'classification'.
Your thoughts???
We have some clover and chicory plots with some alfalfa mixed in as well. The only thing we can use in something called Clearcast. It has the same AI as Raptor but have the price, we have had great success with it. Our brassicas ALWAYS get mowed down, for that purpose we normally have the field that you describe that is mowed down. In September we went through and broadcasted some oats and rye along with a little clover, can’t wait to see how they look this spring! Just a little food for thought
You CAN use cleth on chicory and clover.....both are considered a broadleaf plant, cleth targets grasses.

As for your seeding of the clover and chicory - the clover should be OK for essentially frost seeding, but I am not sure about the chicory. I'm not saying you can't....I just don't know for certain. I would try to target your last snow of the year if you can and do it then (your tracks in the snow can ensure a more even coverage).
I've done very similar - if Brassicas canopied well and were used heavily in fall/winter - they are great candidates for frost seeding or a spring planting - and I think a little chicory would frost seed in well with clover.

Here's a fall brassica plot - in 2010 and how it looked in May 2011 -



definitely lots of soil to contact - In my pic you can see where some Johnson Grass was not totally eradicated - but almost everything else was -
I prefer pure clover. That way, I might have to spray cleth for grass, but can mow to control broadleaf
GREAT inputs. When I put it all together I read that I can do my grass control with cleth and it won't affect the chicory. Also, that I should cut back on the cleth percentage. Makes sense as worst case is that I've still got a dense clover stand. I think I'll do it while the deer are still stomping around in the turnips - - just that much more hoof pressure for seed to soil contact. Thanks to all. Shuf.
I did the same thing. I had a failed corn plot that I planted brassica and cereal grains into and then I broadcast clover seed in the early spring. Deer essentially ignore brassica on my place so most of it rotted but some simply reseeded itself. The clover came in and was great. I would have to go back thru my land tour thread for pics.....but they are there.
"or go back to the PTT/radish mix into the residual clover."
I would manage the clover as a perennial.
I have read that chicory and alfalfa should not be frost seeded, at least notat the same time as clovers, but later. I have overseeded chicory into clovers. The chicory for me at least, has been hit hard selectively in my clovers/ chicory plots.
From Ed Spinnazola: The most effective time to plant chicory is around the end of July or no later than the first of August. This stuff will be attacked by deer sometimes to the point of an hour at a time, with them eating chicory and nothing else. Do not forget to fertilize it with urea (100 lbs per acre around mid September). One early October evening I observed over 20 deer (5 bucks, one a keeper) in this field. The problem that day was that I was in a different field but could observe this pure chicory plot. Two years ago we had a youth hunter located about eighty yards off this plot in the late September youth hunt. He seen five bucks and no does in the AM. It was his first hunt and my rules are "You must take a doe first before you take a buck". He took a doe in the opposite field from this same blind location in the evening hunt. The following year this chicory plot still worked but not as good as the first year.

I intend to spray Roundup and 2-4-D plus overseed this late spring plus cultipack with Oasis chicory in this same plot. Fertilize normally, then fertilize with urea in mid September, with absolutely no tillage intended. With good soil the planting or overseeding methods can be so easy that it's a crime not to plant.
Hope that this helps.