The Mighty Acorn

dogghr

Well-Known Member
Another thread on chill times for fruit production got me thinking of the acorn and its requirements. I watched a squirrel while I was on stand last fall, spend several hours chasing down acorns, and coming back to bury them relentlessly in a 3 foot bare dirt circle he had created. He planted each in seconds and in a very specific method and depth. I wondered how the hundreds of squirrels doing the same were affecting the growth of Oaks for years, decades, perhaps centuries to come.
With acres of oak trees, I tend to take them for granted, unless there is a mast failure. If you follow my thread at all you know I tend to manage as much for a mature timber stand as an early successional stage, trying to balance the two.
I've read a lot of published papers on the subject and each has its merits, but one has to be careful as certain industries can influence the apparent results sometimes. Timber is big business in my state and I have good friends in the industry. I learn a lot from them and they have my utmost respect. But we don't always agree.
So here are but a few things I gleaned from one paper in particular. I'll try to post its link if I can fig out how.

I answered Gallow a question he posed and guesstimated I had 100 mature oaks/ ac. Turns out that is indeed an average. I also said I think my deer could be fed well with 3 mature oaks/ ac. An ac of oaks produces about 250000 acorns. I have 80 ac of them, red, white, black, chestnut, etc. That's a bunch.

All oaks bloom each year with male and female flowers, thus they need no other tree for pollination. Whites produce the acorn, which is the oaks fruit, each year from pollinated flowers. A red oak, produces same flowers, but it requires two years of maturity for that fruit to drop. Indeed the red can have different stages of acorn maturity each year, thus they can drop acorns each year, while hanging on to the immature fruit till the following year.
While we tend to blame late freezes on poor acorn crops, in reality, a high humidity, or heavy rains, or temp variations can easily affect pollination. And not all the flowers on the tree are pollinated, so presence of flowers means nothing in assuming future fall crop.
Less fruit production, means tree puts more of its energy toward growth, hence interest of logging industry of preventing pollination.
Oak trees of similar crowns, will produce same amount of acorns whether it be in open or closed canopy. Releasing competing trees, allow the crown to enlarge, thus increasing mast production.
Oaks can need to be 30+ years old to produce maximum acorn production and some trees are just more genetically proficient to produce acorns.
Early ovule development begins within 1 month after pollination in Lepidobalanus/Whites, and 13 months in Erythrobalanus/reds.
Greatest loss of fruit is from natural abscission , regardless of tree size.

So ponder these thoughts as you troll along the majestic oaks of your land. Spring is not far away, pay attention to those trees, their crowns, their placements, their variety as they begin or continue their fruit production for you habitats many animals.

Next time we shall look at how the lowly acorn goest thru the processes of making your mature oak forests and even how you can improve acorn plantings.
 
I have about 5 acres of west facing ridge with a lot of white and chinkapin oaks. Of the trees i monitor close to the edge of my food plot, i am yet to see a good acorn year after 4 years owning the property. A couple of those years have been good acorn years on properties within 30 miles. Wondering what the story is there. Ive got a massive white oak growing there in full sun that hardly makes an acorn!

You would be hard pressed to walk a woodland this time of year and find a viable acorn around here. Are you finding sound acorns in January/February?
 
I have about 5 acres of west facing ridge with a lot of white and chinkapin oaks. Of the trees i monitor close to the edge of my food plot, i am yet to see a good acorn year after 4 years owning the property. A couple of those years have been good acorn years on properties within 30 miles. Wondering what the story is there. Ive got a massive white oak growing there in full sun that hardly makes an acorn!

You would be hard pressed to walk a woodland this time of year and find a viable acorn around here. Are you finding sound acorns in January/February?
Yea I certainly will see quite a number of still viable acorns laying on the ground despite zero temps and several snows. Certainly some have insect issues and some have begun to decay. I've watched deer munch on leftover acorns well into spring. Couple things for you to look for ….are the trees down low? Much like apples, they do less well in colder frost type pocket areas. Review the weather. Until this year I had 2 back to back hard mast failures. Not sure the reason, but after reading some, I am blaming a very wet spring at time of pollination more than anything as there was not a hard freeze at the time. Perhaps weather is an issue over those four year. Typically oaks do best on south and west facing slopes as you described. Are the trees mature? Are they over crowded with their crowns, preventing proper sunlight?, or competition for water or nutrients?
Disease is another factor. Everything from the gypsy moth, to oak wilt and blight and many others have really given the oaks a beating . You may have issues with any of those despite them looking healthy. I talked with a forester last weed at a hunt show about the display he had of numerous issues with the oak, several of which I don't even deal with yet.
I would get a good forester, or logger to look at the area and give you perhaps a reason for your failure. I still think it prob a temp thing with weather if they are mature enough for production.
 
I see many acorns still on the ground. I might cut some open this week and see what they look like.

My tree planting has several varieties of oaks that don't grow naturally around here. They have been growing now for about 13 years and some of them are getting pretty big now - some more than 30 feet tall. I wonder if eventually having trees producing acorns that don't grow here wild will mean anything special or not. Some I planted that are different from the natives are - cherrybark oak, pin oak, burr oak and overcup oak. There may be some more I'm not remembering.

Of course - also planted several white oaks, red oaks and chinkapin oaks that look just like the natives.
 
NH ... I don't know where you are in KY, but there are Bur Oak (not as many as there once was) in KY. One of the biggest is located in Bourbon County.
See www.uky.edu/hort/Bur-Oak

Additional information (continued):
Because the species is not reseeding itself as fast as individuals are dying, planting bur
oak in the landscape is encouraged.
In Kentucky, bur oak was once common in the Bluegrass region and some stately trees
remain standing. The national champion bur oak is in Paris Ky.
 
Last edited:
NH ... I don't know where you are in KY, but there are Bur Oak (not as many as there once was) in KY. One of the biggest is located in Bourbon County.
See www.uky.edu/hort/Bur-Oak

Additional information (continued):
Because the species is not reseeding itself as fast as individuals are dying, planting bur
oak in the landscape is encouraged.
In Kentucky, bur oak was once common in the Bluegrass region and some stately trees
remain standing. The national champion bur oak is in Paris Ky.

Thanks Oakseeds, yes I was aware it is a native to the state, but it doesn't occur on my farm, and as far as I know, not in the general area around me. The ones I planted are doing well, so it will be a great addition to the landscape here.
 
I see many acorns still on the ground. I might cut some open this week and see what they look like.

My tree planting has several varieties of oaks that don't grow naturally around here. They have been growing now for about 13 years and some of them are getting pretty big now - some more than 30 feet tall. I wonder if eventually having trees producing acorns that don't grow here wild will mean anything special or not. Some I planted that are different from the natives are - cherrybark oak, pin oak, burr oak and overcup oak. There may be some more I'm not remembering.

Of course - also planted several white oaks, red oaks and chinkapin oaks that look just like the natives.
We must have been planting at the same time.:D. My 13-14 yr old cherrybarks are beautiful trees, but no acorns yet.​
 
Dogghr... I get all the rest but you are going to have to explain the high humidity one. I think I know why you said it but want to here it from you.
 
Dogghr... I get all the rest but you are going to have to explain the high humidity one. I think I know why you said it but want to here it from you.
Honestly Deerpatch, I was bit surprised at that affect but embarrassed I never gave it proper thot. I've always blamed poor acorn production on some temp variable yet I saw failures when we had normal temps and no freeze during pollination. Remember, acorns pollinate on a narrow window of about 10 days. Reds tend to do so before whites.
Obviously we think of rain washing away the pollen needed for pistil sex. Of course the pistil is the flowers uturus so to speak. So at high RH, pollen may not be released from the anthers. And of course the anther is the male counterpart. So no sperm/pollen to fertilize the egg from the ovary/pistil, and no pollination occurs to allow development of an acorn.
Studies show RH above 61% reduced pollination success, as one of the factors affecting.
Funny thing as I read thru dozens of articles, that many of the oak studies were done early in the 1900s and quoted quite often in present studies. A lot of infatuation with the Oak tree out there.
Tomorrow I'll try to go thru some of the germination process. That leaf litter on the forest floor provides for more than we give credit for generations far removed from our own.
Thanks for reading, and this is not a monologue but just a conversation thread about a group of trees that land managers are addicted to, so feel free to join in.
 
Years ago i had a biologist tell me that wet springs when oaks and hickories were blooming would reduce the seed crop. Makes sense too. And i can see RH being pretty much the same problem.
 
Years ago i had a biologist tell me that wet springs when oaks and hickories were blooming would reduce the seed crop. Makes sense too. And i can see RH being pretty much the same problem.
I'll be honest, you'd think as much as I am obsessed with Oaks and their acorns, that I really just never spent the time to think how they function specifically. Been fun reading thru publications of studies done since early last century. I know these factors relating to other plants, but just never applied the knowledge to these trees. Typical of not seeing the forests for the trees.
 
We had a huge acorn crop this year. There were so many reds and whites the deer haven't really started on the chestnuts. I haven't looked close but I'm sure there are lots of good acorns on the ground still.


Sent from my iPhone using Deer Hunter Forum
 
Lots of mature oaks loaded with acorns.

7ca2e8e8fa588a79b7ffb08e86307798.jpg
 
Last edited:
We had a huge acorn crop this year. There were so many reds and whites the deer haven't really started on the chestnuts. I haven't looked close but I'm sure there are lots of good acorns on the ground still.


Sent from my iPhone using Deer Hunter Forum
I would have thot chestnuts were as attractive as the acorn. Guess the hull of the Chestnut might be the limiting factor for that?
 
Honestly Deerpatch, I was bit surprised at that affect but embarrassed I never gave it proper thot. I've always blamed poor acorn production on some temp variable yet I saw failures when we had normal temps and no freeze during pollination. Remember, acorns pollinate on a narrow window of about 10 days. Reds tend to do so before whites.
Obviously we think of rain washing away the pollen needed for pistil sex. Of course the pistil is the flowers uturus so to speak. So at high RH, pollen may not be released from the anthers. And of course the anther is the male counterpart. So no sperm/pollen to fertilize the egg from the ovary/pistil, and no pollination occurs to allow development of an acorn.
Studies show RH above 61% reduced pollination success, as one of the factors affecting.
Funny thing as I read thru dozens of articles, that many of the oak studies were done early in the 1900s and quoted quite often in present studies. A lot of infatuation with the Oak tree out there.
Tomorrow I'll try to go thru some of the germination process. That leaf litter on the forest floor provides for more than we give credit for generations far removed from our own.
Thanks for reading, and this is not a monologue but just a conversation thread about a group of trees that land managers are addicted to, so feel free to join in.

Thanks for your in depth reply. My thinking was the same as you stated but simpler to explain. RH makes everything stickier (damp) which will not let pollen transfer into the air which in return will not let the acorn be pollinated. I know we have had years here with poor acorn crops caused by other factors than a late freeze.

My neighbor hated when we had a good acorn crop because the deer were harder to hunt as he liked to hunt the fields but I truly enjoy a good acorn crop myself.
 
Been a bit hectic with time, but try to get this going a little again.
Obviously getting acorns on the ground is only part of the battle of an oak forest. Acorns are consumed by insects, birds, animals, microorganisms. Greatest loss is from nut weevils and gall insects.
The percent of acorns capable of germination is related to the size of the acorn crop. The smaller the crop, the more the entire crop is consumed. In addition, the number of new seedlings added each year to the advanced regeneration is directly related to the size of the acorn crop.
There is also loss of acorns other than due to consumption by organisms as others are lost to freezing, drying, burning in wildfires, and flooding. Again the significance of these losses is dependent on size of the acorn crop that year.
Next we shall look at the germination of the acorn, and then the early growth of the seedlings, which the latter I found really interesting as it pertains to generations far removed from our present.
As with all life, there is a battle of survival from birth to death. Maybe more information than you want as you lay your chainsaw into the tree, but it should give you even more admiration of the complex inner workings of our habitat and how our choices in management can affect results long past even our children's lives.
 
Thanks for your in depth reply. My thinking was the same as you stated but simpler to explain. RH makes everything stickier (damp) which will not let pollen transfer into the air which in return will not let the acorn be pollinated. I know we have had years here with poor acorn crops caused by other factors than a late freeze.

My neighbor hated when we had a good acorn crop because the deer were harder to hunt as he liked to hunt the fields but I truly enjoy a good acorn crop myself.
Yep you said it well. I tend to have diarrhea of the mouth at times. Short and concise, I like that.
 
Yep you said it well. I tend to have diarrhea of the mouth at times. Short and concise, I like that.

I actually like your in depth comments. It makes one think and ponder more which stimulates the brain. Looking forward to your continuation of this thread.
 
Back
Top