Fawn Survival Evidence

[X-farmerdan]

I like to think of myself as a scientist. Science doesn't always have the answers ...or the answers you want to hear. Like everything else in life, there's good science and bad science. Sometimes the ability to tell the difference is difficult, and even good science and its conclusions are difficult to apply across different circumstances. Then, there's the media and how some science gets sensationalized for self-serving purposes whatever they may be. My other lamentation is the lack of true robust wildlife research. It's all about the money. It takes resources to do good work - anywhere.

Having said all of that, I've been delightedly following the Penn State Deer-Forest Study. It's winding down and more analysis is being provided. Today's blog post is about fawn survival. To me it's astounding how few fawns survived (in the study areas).

If you are at all interested in the science of whitetail management it's worth a read.

How it works for you and your interpretations and inferences I'll leave to you!

https://ecosystems.psu.edu/research...Feed:+deer-forest-blog+(The+Deer-Forest+Blog)

 

[Chainsaw]

That is very interesting Dan. I have read that recruitment rates(survival until hunting season) is normally pretty well below one per breeding doe. Conversely here during our fall hunting season most does have two fawns with them and the number that have only one fawn about equal to the number that have three fawns. We have coyotes but we do not mow until July and of course our woods are now mostly brush again due to intensive logging in 2014, 2015 and 2016; thus I wouldn't expect our recruitment rate to be as low as the typical property in this area where most fields are mowed starting May 29 thru June and most woods are brushless. I realize counting fawns per doe in the fall is not a perfect way to measure recruitment but it is how we do it. And of course recruitment is not really the survival measurement because we do not know how many we start with each year.

 

[SwampCat]

Our statewide average fawn recruitment number is just a hair below .5 fawns per doe. In the past three or four days - on my evening ride around the place, I have seen from 7 to 12 does - each evening. I am sure many are probably the same does. I have seen two does with twin fawns. The fawns are pretty good size. That is all the fawns I have seen. The average fetuses per doe is 1.7. So, yes - there is a huge loss somewhere along the line between fetuses per doe and fawns per doe. Fall lactation rate for adult does is around 60%. That means four out of ten don't have any fawns. Most of the losses are probably due to predation. With higher deer densities and lower doe harvest rates - .5 fawns per doe can be OK. But all that changes as deer densities decline.

 

[Elkaddict]

Interesting article, thanks for sharing. IMO, we can’t eliminate predators or harsh winters...but we can manipulate the amount of cover and help with calories to keep does from starving in late winter/early spring.

 

[Mennoniteman]

Interesting article, thanks for sharing. IMO, we can’t eliminate predators or harsh winters...but we can manipulate the amount of cover and help with calories to keep does from starving in late winter/early spring.

I'm with you on food and cover, which actually help alleviate harsh winters. However, I'm not giving up on predators either. According to this Penn State study predators get the lions share of fawns (and other most other game species) If the state wildlife agencies were on board like they were back in the fifties predator numbers could be reduced. Instead of predators getting 20-30% and humans getting 5-6% (according to study) those numbers could be reversed. Coyotes are getting the most fawns here in PA, if they'd put a $50 bounty on coyotes, make the bear season before hibernation, and allow baiting for bears they'd get a lot more than the bounty money back in license fees and other monies that the sportsmen would be spending instate to pursue these game animals.

 

[Baker]

As I'm walking out the door to go fishing for a couple of days I'll confess that I have not read the link yet. But I will offer a couple of anecdotal observations about fawn survival, nutrition and habitat.

The first comes from the arid semi desert country of S. Texas/Mexico. Owning a reasonably large piece of country down there I have seen the transition from low to no fawn survival to much higher fawn survival . By removing cattle from historically overgrazed pastures native grasses started flourishing. But FAR more importantly we started a robust feeding program coupled with a significant expansion of water. Historically deer populations in our neighborhood could be as low as 1 deer per hundred acres. With feed water and better habitat we now run a population of closer to a deer per 15 acres and in fact have to remove significant numbers of females every couple of years. Fawn survival does follow rain fall somewhat but with feed and water we always have survival ranging from 30%-70% with rain being the biggest element. This in a country with as high a predator count as anywhere in N. America...but no bears thankfully

On my farm in La. a similar parallel. When I first acquired the property it was basically nothing but a poorly managed timber stand with few openings. I didn't see a deer for several years and was excited simply to see tracks. After decades of creating planted fields, road r.o.w's.adding protein supplementation, water and managing the timber/habitat I now have to carefully manage population. I'm probably running a deer per 10? acres maybe more. Fawn surveys done in the spring show robust recruitment.....70-80% not uncommon. I believe that we accomplish predator control via habitat/nutrition very effectively .This on a farm with plenty of coyotes,bobcats, feral and neighborhood dogs running around etc. A similar experience to the ranch in Mexico.

Thus my takeaway, at least in the deep south and Mexico is that fawn survival can be enhanced to very acceptable levels by raising the nutritional plane and creating habitat designed for survival.And at the end of the day robust recruitment is a major element to a successful deer management program.

Off to the lake

 

[SwampCat]

I think the dynamics affecting fawn survival are so many that is hard to put your finger on any one thing. Many folks have such a small parcel of land, that all the habitat work in the world is not going to make noticeable improvements in fawn recruitment by improving habitat. A lot of folks lease land where no habitat manipulation is allowed. Habitat improvements are often expensive. Most habitat improvements require some kind of annual maintenance. Low fawn recruitment numbers may work fine in areas of high deer densities. Predators dont have to be “wiped out” to make a difference. For example - I usually have about 15 does show up on my Sep camera surveys. Last year I had just over .6 fawns per doe (state average just under .5 fawns per doe). My does are supplying 9 fawns to the population. If my does produced the state average of .5 fawns per doe - that is 7 or 8 new fawns to the herd each year. My average is better than ten percent higher. That doesnt seem like a lot of difference, but over seven or eight years - it could theoretically double your population if the extra were not harvested. It is plausible to believe the removal of only one or two coyotes just prior to fawning season could save one fawn. Also, remember your habitat improvements generally have no effect on your neighbor’s habitat. If you own 300 acres like I do, and remove two coyotes - you have also temporally reduced the coyote population on your neighbor’s land. I am not saying removal of predators is the key - I am just saying it is one thing to be considered - and not ignored. If deer populations are low in your area - refraining from shooting does may be the quickest way to increase deer numbers. My property is surrounded by small property owners and some public land. A lot of these folks are meat hunters and a doe is meat. There are four of us who hunt my 300 acres and we could legally kill 12 does. We kill none. We used to. We saw the population in our area decline. We quit killing does - and the population has increased. We dont kill does so the surrounding hunters can kill them and the coyotes can kill fawns. Deer management is multi faceted - consider all and find what works best for you. Just because it works in the next county over doesnt mean it works in your county

 

[dogghr]

I'm with you on food and cover, which actually help alleviate harsh winters. However, I'm not giving up on predators either. According to this Penn State study predators get the lions share of fawns (and other most other game species) If the state wildlife agencies were on board like they were back in the fifties predator numbers could be reduced. Instead of predators getting 20-30% and humans getting 5-6% (according to study) those numbers could be reversed. Coyotes are getting the most fawns here in PA, if they'd put a $50 bounty on coyotes, make the bear season before hibernation, and allow baiting for bears they'd get a lot more than the bounty money back in license fees and other monies that the sportsmen would be spending instate to pursue these game animals.

You are right about the bear seasons. Ours for several years has started early Sept until end of year. Certainly has reduced them but like deer they seem to be able to really explode. Too much a season I think but bear group has great power. You can kill a man here and get less time than second offense of illegal bear. And while season is long anyway, they are allowed run the damn dogs year round. And if you've never had the pleasure of going down a dirt track and meeting some yahoo in his toyota pickup traveling 60 mph in the gravel chasing his dogs, you've not had the chance to see your life flash before your eyes. Talked to a dude yesterday that saw a bear crossing road with fawn in mouth. Not sure if it was road kill or not, but they do take quite a few I think.
Also saw this past weekend a big bear laying dead on interstate, with the car bumper laying beside him. Funny but not funny. I guess various ways to reduce predator numbers. I can't wait for everyone to deal with bear. They are coming in numbers soon to all.
And I'm not entering the predator conversation again, you guys know my opinion all to well.

 

[SwampCat]

You are right about the bear seasons. Ours for several years has started early Sept until end of year. Certainly has reduced them but like deer they seem to be able to really explode. Too much a season I think but bear group has great power. You can kill a man here and get less time than second offense of illegal bear. And while season is long anyway, they are allowed run the damn dogs year round. And if you've never had the pleasure of going down a dirt track and meeting some yahoo in his toyota pickup traveling 60 mph in the gravel chasing his dogs, you've not had the chance to see your life flash before your eyes. Talked to a dude yesterday that saw a bear crossing road with fawn in mouth. Not sure if it was road kill or not, but they do take quite a few I think.
Also saw this past weekend a big bear laying dead on interstate, with the car bumper laying beside him. Funny but not funny. I guess various ways to reduce predator numbers. I can't wait for everyone to deal with bear. They are coming in numbers soon to all.
And I'm not entering the predator conversation again, you guys know my opinion all to well.

GA DNR has documented 90% decline in deer population across six north ga wma’s over the past 30 years and attibutes the main cause for decline to bears. My state is moving problem bears to property adjacent to mine. If you already have low fawn recruitment numbers and lower deer densities - the addition of another successful fawn predator is not likely to improve the situation.

 

[Chainsaw]

I believe that here the biggest threat to fawns are mowing machines, twelve ft. wide front mowers especially that travel at quite high speeds and cut to within an inch or two of the ground but even slower rear and side mounted mowers take a lot of fawns as well.. Of course no one is about to report to DEC or any other study that they ran over five fawns today and four yesterday and on and on. It just so happens here that first cutting corresponds with fawning season so prohibiting any cutting on ones' property here during the last week of May and the month of June saves many, many fawns. Those of us that are non-farmer landowners have the option to shut down mowing during that time where as for full-time farmers it is just not realistic to do so. Our property does not have any bears during fawning season so that helps as well.

 

[shaman]

I hunt in Zone 1 in Kentucky. Zone 1 means you can take any number of antlerless deer you want during season. Bottom line: they're trying (unsuccessfully) to reduce the herd. Truth is, they're barely keeping up.

Around my place in SW Bracken County, unless I have active poaching going on, the resident herd stays pretty well stocked. I'm sure there is predation going on. There are a quite a few coyotes and feral dogs. However, there are just so many deer that anything that gets eaten is replaced with deer migrating from off the property. About 2010 I had some rat-bag neighbors who poached wantonly. The one kid was shooting them with a 22 out his bedroom window. By 2013 we were nearly out of deer. However, in every year since, we've had constantly improving herds and good hunting results.

I have my hay cut. When I first arrived at the farm, the guy was cutting in June. For the past decade, the cutting has been September or October. I really haven't seen a huge difference in the number of fawns I see. Some years are good. Some years you see hardly a one. What I do see is that over time, the number of fawns with spots in November has increased. I cannot account for this. The past few years, they've seen to survive the winter well, despite rather harsh bouts of cold and snow.

 

[WILD CAT]

I like to think of myself as a scientist. Science doesn't always have the answers ...or the answers you want to hear. Like everything else in life, there's good science and bad science. Sometimes the ability to tell the difference is difficult, and even good science and its conclusions are difficult to apply across different circumstances. Then, there's the media and how some science gets sensationalized for self-serving purposes whatever they may be. My other lamentation is the lack of true robust wildlife research. It's all about the money. It takes resources to do good work - anywhere.

Having said all of that, I've been delightedly following the Penn State Deer-Forest Study. It's winding down and more analysis is being provided. Today's blog post is about fawn survival. To me it's astounding how few fawns survived (in the study areas).

If you are at all interested in the science of whitetail management it's worth a read.

How it works for you and your interpretations and inferences I'll leave to you!

https://ecosystems.psu.edu/research/projects/deer/news/2018/all-good-things?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=Feed:+deer-forest-blog+(The+Deer-Forest+Blog)

Very interesting and instructive article!!! thanks for the info

 

[SwampCat]

I hunt in Zone 1 in Kentucky. Zone 1 means you can take any number of antlerless deer you want during season. Bottom line: they're trying (unsuccessfully) to reduce the herd. Truth is, they're barely keeping up.

Around my place in SW Bracken County, unless I have active poaching going on, the resident herd stays pretty well stocked. I'm sure there is predation going on. There are a quite a few coyotes and feral dogs. However, there are just so many deer that anything that gets eaten is replaced with deer migrating from off the property. About 2010 I had some rat-bag neighbors who poached wantonly. The one kid was shooting them with a 22 out his bedroom window. By 2013 we were nearly out of deer. However, in every year since, we've had constantly improving herds and good hunting results.

I have my hay cut. When I first arrived at the farm, the guy was cutting in June. For the past decade, the cutting has been September or October. I really haven't seen a huge difference in the number of fawns I see. Some years are good. Some years you see hardly a one. What I do see is that over time, the number of fawns with spots in November has increased. I cannot account for this. The past few years, they've seen to survive the winter well, despite rather harsh bouts of cold and snow.

A lot of our opinions of various articles and thread posts are all based on our personal perspectives. Those of you with elevated deer densities may well ignore the predator presence. Those of us struggling to see deer may consider predators our worst nightmare. I have two properties, eight miles apart in the same river basin. On my home ground, in the past, we have struggled to see deer. I have implemented all the wildlife management practices I realistically am able to do, remove some predators, we dont shoot does - pass almost every buck - and we are finally starting to see some deer. On my other property eight miles away, I plant a couple food plots, no cover management, we shoot does and we have plenty of deer.

I always have to laugh a little when I read posts on these forums telling other people what they should do on property five hundred miles away. They need to relate what they do and let the rest decide what will work for them. My two properties just eight miles apart manage nothing alike.

 

[shaman]

A lot of our opinions of various articles and thread posts are all based on our personal perspectives. Those of you with elevated deer densities may well ignore the predator presence.

I quite agree. It's gotten so I have stopped worrying. For a while there, we were pushing hard to take coyotes, but in reality, we hardly made a dent in them. Between them and the feral dogs, it seemed like we were screwed. In reality the deer just kept filling in from outside the property. All of a sudden, the dogs disappeared. The density got high enough that Parvo set in and wiped them out. Now their numbers are climbing again. Meanwhile, the deer go about their lives seemingly unaffected.

What I see is that by November, every doe group on the farm has at least one youngster that's survived. At some point the doe wise up, and figure out how to protect the last one. In the meanwhile, it's hard to say how many perished. If it's a button, he's already been kicked out to the periphery of the herd. If it's a doe fawn, she's sticking tight to her mother and the rest of the group are close by.

One other thing: when the poachers did a number on our deer, they were pretty indiscriminant. What I'm seeing is that the doe fill back in they are gradually gaining size and smart. In 2011, before the trouble really started, I took back-to-back doe each weighing 170 lbs + live weight and they weren't the matriarchs either. For a number of years, when we did take a doe, she was much smaller. Once the herd ages, the deer become bigger, and smarter, and they tend to learn how to fend off predators better.

 

[Baker]

I believe that here the biggest threat to fawns are mowing machines, twelve ft. wide front mowers especially that travel at quite high speeds and cut to within an inch or two of the ground but even slower rear and side mounted mowers take a lot of fawns as well.. Of course no one is about to report to DEC or any other study that they ran over five fawns today and four yesterday and on and on. It just so happens here that first cutting corresponds with fawning season so prohibiting any cutting on ones' property here during the last week of May and the month of June saves many, many fawns. Those of us that are non-farmer landowners have the option to shut down mowing during that time where as for full-time farmers it is just not realistic to do so. Our property does not have any bears during fawning season so that helps as well.

I whole heartedly agree with this. Many would be well advised to park their mowers all summer. There is a tendency to want things to look 'pretty' vs. whats best for wildlife. I do no mowing till after June 15 which is well after fawning and turkey nesting down here. Then I only mow clover fields and roads. All r.o.w's. and opening only get mowed once a year in the fall. By then they have served their purpose and are done anyhow.

Y'all can keep the bears.

 

[Laker]

Y'all can keep the bears.

I rode up on one last weekend at my place while I was spraying weeds. It was a middle sized bear and just stuck it's nose in the air and sniffed away. It looked at me for a few seconds, and I looked at it. Then, it just casually walked away. I like seeing them. Maybe they kill some fawns. Maybe the wolves do too. So long as there's one or two left for me every year, it's OK.

I guess we were about 50 yards apart. I will also admit the .357 on my hip was a comfort. Also, if they ever start tearing up my stuff, my opinion may change too.

 

[Mennoniteman]

I rode up on one last weekend at my place while I was spraying weeds. It was a middle sized bear and just stuck it's nose in the air and sniffed away. It looked at me for a few seconds, and I looked at it. Then, it just casually walked away. I like seeing them. Maybe they kill some fawns. Maybe the wolves do to. So long as there's one or two left for me every year, it's OK.

I guess we were about 50 yards apart. I will also admit the .357 on my hip was a comfort. Also, if they ever start tearing up my stuff, my opinion may change too.

Start tearing up your stuff? It's just a matter of time. My friend had a beautiful young apple tree, six inch diameter, shaped perfectly, just coming into it's prime, a bear totally destroyed it last fall...

 

[Laker]

Start tearing up your stuff? It's just a matter of time. My friend had a beautiful young apple tree, six inch diameter, shaped perfectly, just coming into it's prime, a bear totally destroyed it last fall...

I agree, that'd be pretty hard to take. No fruit trees for me yet. Heck, I'm still in the "barely able to grow WR" phase.

 

[SwampCat]

DNR agencies should keep an eye on fawn recruitment numbers and be responsive to a new fawn predator on the landscape and take appropriate action concerning antlerless harvest IF there is a drop in fawn recruitment as a result of a new predator.

 

[Mennoniteman]

DNR agencies should keep an eye on fawn recruitment numbers and be responsive to a new fawn predator on the landscape and take appropriate action concerning antlerless harvest IF there is a drop in fawn recruitment as a result of a new predator.

Nobody can say it better than Native; "that's what you get when hippie heathens are running the government. A high percentage of them are into new age cults - like Shamanism and Neopaganism that worship predators, and think they are being lead by "Spirit Guides." To them the "new coyote" should be worthy of double worship - because it is both coyote and wolf - both of which are sacred in the cult religions"