SAVAGE 220 BOLT ACTION SLUG GUN VS STRAIGHTWALL CALIBERS

[Mennoniteman]

I'm getting ready to take a handicapped hunter out for deer in a special regulations area, straightwall cartridges only. Since I don't own any of the newer straightwall guns like the .350 Legend, I'm thinking of taking my Savage 220 bolt action 20 ga with a fixed rifled barrel, shooting Hornady 250 grain SST sabots. I've been shooting nice groups at 80 yards, and this gun seems like a reasonable low-recoil choice, but I've heard that the .350 is also very accurate with very low recoil. How do these two guns compare?

 

[Native Hunter]

I'm not into the straightwall cartridges and don't have any experience with them. However, I do enjoy tinkering with ballistics, so I ran the 350 out on a Ballistic Calculator and copied the 20 gauge info from a Hornady advertisement. Both guns are zeroed at 150 yards.

As you can see below, the energy in ft/lbs at the muzzle is about the same, which means that recoil should be about the same with all other factors being equal. However, at 200 yards the 350 is giving you 13% more energy and also has 3 inches less drop.

My thought are that you should be able to get a good 350 to group much tighter than a 20 gauge at 200 yards, but as stated earlier - I don't have any actual experience with one. I hope this helps.


20 gauge with Hornady SST 250 slug:

Muzzle vel = 1800 fps Drop = -1.5 inches energy = 1798 ft/lb
50 Yards vel = 1628 fps Drop = +2.5 inches energy = 1471 ft/lb
100 yards vel = 1470 fps Drop = +3.3 inches energy = 1200 ft/lb
150 yards vel = 1331 fps Drop = 0 energy = 983 ft/lb
200 yards vel = 1212 fps Drop = - 8.2 inches energy = 815 ft/lb


350 Legend with 180 grain Soft Point Factory ammo

Range (yd)	Drop (in)	Wind Drift (in)	Velocity (fps)	Energy (ft-lb)
Muzzle	-1.5	0.0	2100	1762
50	1.5	0.4	1942	1508
100	2.1	2.0	1793	1284
150	0.0	4.9	1652	1091
200	-5.2	8.9	1520	924

PS - This is where I got the slug info: https://www.hornady.com/ammunition/shotgun/20-ga-sst-slug-250-gr-sst#!/

 

[George]

.350 kicks like a mule at the cash register. Winchester, $800.00.

G

 

[Mennoniteman]

I'm not into the straightwall cartridges and don't have any experience with them. However, I do enjoy tinkering with ballistics, so I ran the 350 out on a Ballistic Calculator and copied the 20 gauge info from a Hornady advertisement. Both guns are zeroed at 150 yards.

As you can see below, the energy in ft/lbs at the muzzle is about the same, which means that recoil should be about the same with all other factors being equal. However, at 200 yards the 350 is giving you 13% more energy and also has 3 inches less drop.

My thought are that you should be able to get a good 350 to group much tighter than a 20 gauge at 200 yards, but as stated earlier - I don't have any actual experience with one. I hope this helps.


20 gauge with Hornady SST 250 slug:

Muzzle vel = 1800 fps Drop = -1.5 inches energy = 1798 ft/lb
50 Yards vel = 1628 fps Drop = +2.5 inches energy = 1471 ft/lb
100 yards vel = 1470 fps Drop = +3.3 inches energy = 1200 ft/lb
150 yards vel = 1331 fps Drop = 0 energy = 983 ft/lb
200 yards vel = 1212 fps Drop = - 8.2 inches energy = 815 ft/lb


350 Legend with 180 grain Soft Point Factory ammo

Range (yd)	Drop (in)	Wind Drift (in)	Velocity (fps)	Energy (ft-lb)
Muzzle	-1.5	0.0	2100	1762
50	1.5	0.4	1942	1508
100	2.1	2.0	1793	1284
150	0.0	4.9	1652	1091
200	-5.2	8.9	1520	924

PS - This is where I got the slug info: https://www.hornady.com/ammunition/shotgun/20-ga-sst-slug-250-gr-sst#!/

Thanks for doing those two comparisons, that's very interesting how close the ballistics compare to each other. The biggest difference seems to be in the bullet weights, that 240 grain vs 180 is going to be moving significantly slower at 200 yards, therefore shedding energy. But at closer ranges, with a good bullet like the Hornady SST, shouldn't the 20 ga. should have an edge in knockdown power?
I should have mentioned, here in PA in special regulations areas there's usually no shots taken much beyond 100 yards, and our average shots are probably 60-70 yards. So I'm not an engineer, but, at 50 yards the 20 gauge has a larger diameter bullet moving much slower, yet still with almost the same energy. Is the whole story of deer knockdown power written in that energy number, or will the 20 ga. perform better because it has a larger diameter bullet with the same energy, or is the .350 better at 50 yards because it has the same energy but much greater velocity?

 

[Native Hunter]

Thanks for doing those two comparisons, that's very interesting how close the ballistics compare to each other. The biggest difference seems to be in the bullet weights, that 240 grain vs 180 is going to show up going slower at 200 yards, therefore shedding energy. But at closer ranges, with a good bullet like the Hornady SST, shouldn't the 20 ga. should have an edge in knockdown power?
I should have mentioned, here in PA in special regulations areas there's usually no shots taken much beyond 100 yards, and our average shots are probably 60-70 yards. So I'm not an engineer, at 50 yards the 20 gauge has a larger diameter bullet moving much slower but with almost the same energy. Is the whole story of deer knockdown power written in that energy number, or will the 20 ga. perform better because it has a larger diameter bullet with the same energy, or is the .350 better at 50 yards because it has the same energy but much greater velocity?

In my opinion, the differences between the two become negligible at 50 yards. Both are more than capable of taking a deer if shot placement is good. At that yardage that advantages of either choice (extra velocity versus bigger hole) seem insignificant to me, because both should get the job done.

 

[Mennoniteman]

In my opinion, the differences between the two become negligible at 50 yards. Both are more than capable of taking a deer if shot placement is good. At that yardage that advantages of either choice (extra velocity versus bigger hole) seem insignificant to me, because both should get the job done.

Yes, I guess I was kind-of posing this question as to which is the better deer cartridge, but my main issue is which might have the lesser recoil. As per Drs. orders my shooter is supposed to avoid any bumps due to a head injury, and I'm a bit puzzled as to how firearms recoil fits in with this. Of course the hunter doesn't think it's a problem.

 

[Native Hunter]

Yes, I guess I was kind-of posing this question as to which is the better deer cartridge, but my main issue is which might have the lesser recoil. As per Drs. orders my shooter is supposed to avoid any bumps due to a head injury, and I'm a bit puzzled as to how firearms recoil fits in with this. Of course the hunter doesn't think it's a problem.

The ft/lbs of energy at the muzzle is the determining factor in the actual recoil. However, the feeling of recoil experienced by the shooter depends on a combination of factors. For instance, a heavier gun will exhibit less “felt recoil” because the extra weight makes the recoil feel more like a push rather than a blow. I could recommend three things:

First, whatever gun you use, equip it with one of the premium slip on recoil pads. Even if you need to remove the existing hard pad to compensate for the extra length, this will help tremendously. Use a good one like The Shooters Friend or one of the other quality pads. When I shot competition I would sometimes shoot over 100 three inch magnum Turkey loads in a day. My pads saved me from the abuse.

Second, if you are only shooting 50 yards, both of those loads above are overkill. You could get by with lighter loads. If you have a friend who is a an accomplished reloader, talk to them about coming up with some less powerful handloads that will kick less but still do the job.

Third, people who have never used a firearm with a barrel correctly ported to reduce recoil don’t realize how effective they are. I shoot a ported 300 mag, and it feels to me about like when I shoot my non ported 308 Win. The drawback of course is the increased sound to the shooter from the blast, but anyone not using good ear protection is crazy in my opinion. So, since I won’t pull the trigger without ear protection, it’s not a drawback to me.

Good luck.

 

[DJN]

I’ve shot plenty of both and the 350 has less recoil than the slug gun. Many 350 rifles come with a threaded muzzle as well and you can add a muzzle brake to bring recoil down to near nothing. Just remember ear protection with those brakes!!

 

[gjs4]

I think theyre renaming it to the 350 OHio. LOL. The 6.5cr got so much hate...but this 350L seems twice as popular in a deer hunting state.

Had a couple 220s. Great guns BUT good slugs are hard to find in 20ga. I had one early and was using Barnes, Remington bought and discontinued them. Then i went to Rem Accutips.....could find them and sold both guns. You need to rack them like youre trying to rip the bolt out of the action and they still stovepipe on occasion.

 

[Mennoniteman]

I think theyre renaming it to the 350 OHio. LOL. The 6.5cr got so much hate...but this 350L seems twice as popular in a deer hunting state.

Had a couple 220s. Great guns BUT good slugs are hard to find in 20ga. I had one early and was using Barnes, Remington bought and discontinued them. Then i went to Rem Accutips.....could find them and sold both guns. You need to rack them like youre trying to rip the bolt out of the action and they still stovepipe on occasion.

Here's some good ammo https://www.cabelas.com/shop/en/hornady-sst-shotgun-slug-shotshells It's slightly expensive, but I stocked up back in the day when it was cheap, still got enough for quite a few years.
the bolt on my 220 is smooth as butter (but not quite as smooth as my Sako) and I never had any feed issues with the Hornady ammuniton.

 

[Mennoniteman]

I’ve shot plenty of both and the 350 has less recoil than the slug gun. Many 350 rifles come with a threaded muzzle as well and you can add a muzzle brake to bring recoil down to near nothing. Just remember ear protection with those brakes!!

Thanks, that's good to know, That's the info I was looking for, someone who's shot plenty of both. I guess I need to put a .350 on my shopping list

 

[T.R.]

A good supply of 20 gauge slugs is difficult to find in my area. So I bought a CVA Hunter model in 44 MAG. This is a very accurate break action single shot rifle. I fitted it with a 1.5-4.5X Bushnell scope. Recoil is light and ammo is readily available. TR