Chummer
Active Member
I had never seen a tick on the Tug Hill until last year. Two different hunts I was in my tree stand and had one crawling on me. I also had some on the deer I shot.
Recreating a Deer Woods
- Thread starter Chainsaw
- Start date
Mennoniteman
Well-Known Member
I know a guy that got rid of his deer ticks by using ivermectin pour on product on corn in his deer feeder, he said it worked like a charm, he had an extreme tick problem, and did it for one winter, and the ticks disappeared within weeks, he recently said 6-7 years later his deer still have no deer ticks. Note; While all the deer farmers do it, using ivermectin on wild deer is a very controversial topic with sportsmen.
Chainsaw
Well-Known Member
Good luck tomorrow Chummer. i'd like to come out and "watch" but Anne has a huge to do list for me. Be sure to check out the link to Steve's tip of the week. https://www.facebook.com/steve.bartylla/posts/755155691333028
It is the same one I linked to one page back. The design of the apple tree release might fit that section of yours that is deeper in the woods at the junction of the two drainages where there were also some hemlocks. The screening created by dropping the "junk" trees in bunches would really add to that spot. It would have been the last two clumps of apple we saw on our last walk. Be safe.
Looking forward to the pics. It's going to be open at first but it fills in quickly.
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Chainsaw
Well-Known Member
I don't have a clue why the ticks are thick, really thick north of here and not bad here. And the same with you thick south of you but not so bad where you are.
Mennoniteman, that sounds like an option worth investigating at least in the states where baiting or feeding is legal. In NY either is a no-no. I had never heard of it though--very interesting.
Hey, J-bird, that was cool.
Chainsaw
Well-Known Member
I'm thinking the worst on this Buckly. Some ticks could have been born and survived with some with a genetic makeup that can withstand the cold weather we get (evolved) and thus it may just be a matter of time that we have them as common as we hear about elsewhere. I hope that is not the case but I just don't see any other explanation.
Mennoniteman
Well-Known Member
Like I said, ivermectin is a very controversial subject. But with the Lyme epidemic all options should be considered.
Mennoniteman
Well-Known Member
P.S. I read about a study done in Texas where they put a deer bait station laced with ivermectin every sq.mi. and the results were they wiped out all the deer ticks. It'd be cheaper than treating Lyme disease
shedder
Active Member
Buckly
Well-Known Member
Ivermectin will kill all internal and external parasites. It's frequently used in cattle and swine, mostly injected I think. We used it on our fox farms back in the day and it was injected. It just seems to me that you would need a very large amount of it used by putting it on feed. Maybe some cattle guys can shed light on how it's used in cattle.
Mennoniteman
Well-Known Member
There's a recommended dosage for deer thanks to all the deer farms. They used to have it dry mix in 25lb bags. As I recall he used about half a coffee can in 300 lbs of feed. It would actually not be that expensive
Mennoniteman
Well-Known Member
They discontinued it several years ago. But they have it in liquid form to pour on feed.
Chainsaw
Well-Known Member
Our property has been proclaimed by some to be “really a giant deer garden”, both a garden OF and also a garden FOR deer. While I smile inside and out when a visitor SEES that and comes up with the deer garden phrase, I know that really the property falls way short of a true deer garden. The phrase “deer garden” insinuates a perfectly controlled and orderly world, a place where an entire micro-environment lives and works in harmony to synergistic-ally create the perfect world FOR and OF deer. In my recreating a deer woods project, a true deer garden is the ultimate outcome. Perfection though in creating this deer garden is just not humanly possible; the task is simply larger than us. At best if others see the property as a deer garden then a deer garden it must be. As deer gardeners we all know how far from the perfect deer garden our properties really are. Still with each swing of the axe (so to speak) our properties can be brought closer and closer to being true deer gardens.
With it being spring it is time to begin anew, to slooooowwwwww down and see the “flowers” of this wonderful season which grow in our individual deer gardens. This week and next are the weeks of explosive bloom, growth and transition to resetting the stage for yet another great chapter in our deer garden books. Do deer appreciate seeing the blooms? That we don’t know; one thing we do know is that the blooms are one very important step in creating the coming year’s food sources for the deer and other wildlife living in our deer gardens. Also the simple, delicate blooms are a make or break step in creating the next generation of ground cover plants, shrubs and trees. Those blooms better have big shoulders!
One of the joys of living on the property (in the deer garden) is getting to witness each year’s blooms most of which last only a week or less. This is the week of the service berry blooms, maple blooms and pear blooms as well as others here. And there are the transitions of grain fields going from dormant to green as well as the evidence of regeneration to see. And left over from winter there is the evidence of browse left or not that gives us a measure of how our deer gardens are really stacking up to our deer garden goals. Also left over from winter are the deer trails muddied up and as obvious as ever. In fact they look like dirt bike trails! The next two weeks are truly the weeks to really see and enjoy the story the property is ready to share with us.
Today’s special bloom in this deer garden is the service berry tree. Its presence to a perfect deer garden is important. The service berry is a great deer browse plant (creates lots of suckers) and related to the apple, it creates berries that feed a lot of wildlife. It is among the first major blooms of each year providing an early source of pollen. Its flower is very simple.
But oh put together many thousands or so of these simple flowers and they can be seen a quarter of a mile away as shown in the next picture.
An up close picture of the same service berry trees in full bloom shows it to be as impressive as the more celebrated apple bloom which promises to follow within a week. As I approached closer to the service berry trees, a group of deer feeding in the triticale reluctantly gave up the space; maybe they were there also enjoying the blooms in the deer garden just as I was.
Service berry trees are easy enough to distinguish from other trees but like wild apple trees they are difficult to SEE in the woods of our deer gardens. So today I flagged several of them which were easily found by their blooms. Like the wild apple trees they will be released someday so they will have a chance to become the most spectacular tree they can be. Without releasing them the service berry trees often stay spindly and weak and not so productive; not released, some service berry trees will even become shaded out and strangled in grape vines and die just as the wild apple trees do. That would be a big loss to our deer gardens.
While the beautiful service berry trees pictured above would benefit from releasing by cutting out that one large cherry tree, they are receiving a good enough share of the sun as they are. However the service berry trees in the next picture are not and are a good example of some that must be released if they are to stay alive and reinforce the deer garden status of this property.
In recreating a deer woods or trying to reach deer garden status here it is really about capitalizing on the existing ground plant, shrub and tree population already growing rather than a lot of planting new. Both efforts have their place to be sure. However by releasing the service berry trees in this field edge they will likely be healthy and productive trees within about two years versus the twenty it would take to grow new service berry trees to an equivalent size. Thus since I like the location they are in, it just makes sense to take the time to release them rather than lose them.
With it being spring it is time to begin anew, to slooooowwwwww down and see the “flowers” of this wonderful season which grow in our individual deer gardens. This week and next are the weeks of explosive bloom, growth and transition to resetting the stage for yet another great chapter in our deer garden books. Do deer appreciate seeing the blooms? That we don’t know; one thing we do know is that the blooms are one very important step in creating the coming year’s food sources for the deer and other wildlife living in our deer gardens. Also the simple, delicate blooms are a make or break step in creating the next generation of ground cover plants, shrubs and trees. Those blooms better have big shoulders!
One of the joys of living on the property (in the deer garden) is getting to witness each year’s blooms most of which last only a week or less. This is the week of the service berry blooms, maple blooms and pear blooms as well as others here. And there are the transitions of grain fields going from dormant to green as well as the evidence of regeneration to see. And left over from winter there is the evidence of browse left or not that gives us a measure of how our deer gardens are really stacking up to our deer garden goals. Also left over from winter are the deer trails muddied up and as obvious as ever. In fact they look like dirt bike trails! The next two weeks are truly the weeks to really see and enjoy the story the property is ready to share with us.
Today’s special bloom in this deer garden is the service berry tree. Its presence to a perfect deer garden is important. The service berry is a great deer browse plant (creates lots of suckers) and related to the apple, it creates berries that feed a lot of wildlife. It is among the first major blooms of each year providing an early source of pollen. Its flower is very simple.
But oh put together many thousands or so of these simple flowers and they can be seen a quarter of a mile away as shown in the next picture.
An up close picture of the same service berry trees in full bloom shows it to be as impressive as the more celebrated apple bloom which promises to follow within a week. As I approached closer to the service berry trees, a group of deer feeding in the triticale reluctantly gave up the space; maybe they were there also enjoying the blooms in the deer garden just as I was.
Service berry trees are easy enough to distinguish from other trees but like wild apple trees they are difficult to SEE in the woods of our deer gardens. So today I flagged several of them which were easily found by their blooms. Like the wild apple trees they will be released someday so they will have a chance to become the most spectacular tree they can be. Without releasing them the service berry trees often stay spindly and weak and not so productive; not released, some service berry trees will even become shaded out and strangled in grape vines and die just as the wild apple trees do. That would be a big loss to our deer gardens.
While the beautiful service berry trees pictured above would benefit from releasing by cutting out that one large cherry tree, they are receiving a good enough share of the sun as they are. However the service berry trees in the next picture are not and are a good example of some that must be released if they are to stay alive and reinforce the deer garden status of this property.
In recreating a deer woods or trying to reach deer garden status here it is really about capitalizing on the existing ground plant, shrub and tree population already growing rather than a lot of planting new. Both efforts have their place to be sure. However by releasing the service berry trees in this field edge they will likely be healthy and productive trees within about two years versus the twenty it would take to grow new service berry trees to an equivalent size. Thus since I like the location they are in, it just makes sense to take the time to release them rather than lose them.
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shedder
Active Member
Have you considered bringing in bees to pollinate all those blossoms?
https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2017/04/170420171509.htm
Some bee people may be looking for a source of clean food for bees. They get that, you get pollination.
"It is my perception that apple blossoms are much more attractive to pollinators than European pear blossoms with Asian pears somewhere in between. Part of the attraction might be fragrance. European pears are almost fragrance free. Asian pears smell putrid. Apple blossoms smell nice and tend to be more densely packed on the tree."
http://eatonrapidsjoe.blogspot.ca/2017/04/pollinators.html
An interesting comment.
https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2017/04/170420171509.htm
Some bee people may be looking for a source of clean food for bees. They get that, you get pollination.
"It is my perception that apple blossoms are much more attractive to pollinators than European pear blossoms with Asian pears somewhere in between. Part of the attraction might be fragrance. European pears are almost fragrance free. Asian pears smell putrid. Apple blossoms smell nice and tend to be more densely packed on the tree."
http://eatonrapidsjoe.blogspot.ca/2017/04/pollinators.html
An interesting comment.
Chainsaw
Well-Known Member
Thanks Shedder, the blog post and comment were very interesting. The limited use of fly tape is an excellent method of determining insect visitors to the garden. As to moving bee hives onto the property during bloom I'm not so sure it would be a good idea for me. At times I had thought it was a good idea but two regularly occurring events have changed my mind. Each summer some apple trees have so many apples that the excess weight causes large limbs to break. The trees begin dropping "excess" apples sometime in early summer but evidently they don't drop enough. So those trees apparently do not need additional pollinators. Yes commercial apple growers do it but their trimmed apple trees likely have stronger tree structure as well as less blooms per limb.
Additionally in my daylily gardens when I am hybridizing the daylilies I need pollen. Often by 8 am the pollen has already been completely taken by the insects. On some days the pollen isn't even ripe until 8 am and I can't collect it quick enough to get what I need for the day before the bees and other insects have "stolen it" from me.. Some periods the pollen thieves are so numerous that I bring the unopened daylily buds into the house where the bloom and its golden treasure will be safe from the bands of marauding insects. The pollen is then collected in the house when the bloom opens. It works some but it limits my pollen choices. None of the many other daylily hybridize-rs I talk with have the problem of too many pollen grabbers but it shows every area is different. So while most areas would benefit from more pollinators, it appears to not be the case here.
My conclusion on the bees is that the local farmers here must have a lot of bees that don't get enough pollen "at home" during the spring apple bloom and the summer daylily bloom so they come visiting my daylily and deer gardens regularly. And along with the local wild insects, the apples and daylilies are acceptably pollinated and if its possible maybe even over-pollinated most years.
Took this chart off of beesource.com.
While the bees do travel further to collect pollen if needed, the site has established four miles to be the max where the bee receives a net gain for his trip.
Additionally in my daylily gardens when I am hybridizing the daylilies I need pollen. Often by 8 am the pollen has already been completely taken by the insects. On some days the pollen isn't even ripe until 8 am and I can't collect it quick enough to get what I need for the day before the bees and other insects have "stolen it" from me.. Some periods the pollen thieves are so numerous that I bring the unopened daylily buds into the house where the bloom and its golden treasure will be safe from the bands of marauding insects. The pollen is then collected in the house when the bloom opens. It works some but it limits my pollen choices. None of the many other daylily hybridize-rs I talk with have the problem of too many pollen grabbers but it shows every area is different. So while most areas would benefit from more pollinators, it appears to not be the case here.
My conclusion on the bees is that the local farmers here must have a lot of bees that don't get enough pollen "at home" during the spring apple bloom and the summer daylily bloom so they come visiting my daylily and deer gardens regularly. And along with the local wild insects, the apples and daylilies are acceptably pollinated and if its possible maybe even over-pollinated most years.
Took this chart off of beesource.com.
While the bees do travel further to collect pollen if needed, the site has established four miles to be the max where the bee receives a net gain for his trip.
