Ground cover taking over

[weekender21]

I noticed my GLY application back in August didn’t kill a small green leaf ground cover. I sprayed again just to make sure it got the message. It did not. The tiny leaves turned into a large mat in s few areas of my plot.

Picture this is calling it smooth hawks beard or common dandelion depending on the picture.

Is it too late for a crossbow (24d) application? Temp range from 25-45 at night and 45-70 during the day. Plant is still green and growing I think.

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[Lewi B]

Look up cudweed.
I am not good at weed id but think that is cudweed. It came on hard in some of my plots this year.

 

[weekender21]

https://content.ces.ncsu.edu/cudweed

Definitely could be the cudweed family


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[massey]

Looks like native chickory sprouted in your bare dirt.


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[massey]

Could also be a type of plantain


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[RGrizzzz]

What was your Gly rate? Do you add AMS? Do you using hard water in the sprayer? That will affect burn down.

 

[weekender21]

What was your Gly rate? Do you add AMS? Do you using hard water in the sprayer? That will affect burn down.

5 quarts/acre, AMS and a surfactant both times. Everything was smoked except for this one plant species. The plants were much smaller at the time of herbicide application, little tiny green leaves.


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[RGrizzzz]

I'd expect 24D to work, as long as it's a warm day. I'd look at the rainfast time on the label, and get it down as the day is starting to warm up. I don't have a label handy, but 4 hours sticks in my mind.

 

[weekender21]

This is the same plant in September after two applications of herbicide.

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[weekender21]

https://www.ag.ndsu.edu/weeds/weed-of-the-year-files/18WeedofYear.pdf

Good description of hawks beard and how to treat. All of the fall treatments call for Glyphosate + additional such as 24d. That’s consistent with my failure to control with Gly only.


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[Mennoniteman]

Since its an annual, and supposedly gly kills hawksbeard very well, it's puzzling as to why your earlier treatment didn't clean it up. Often a herbicide failure isn't the fault of the product, but the application. What spray rig do you use?
What planting did you have in the plot before, and what are you planning to grow next?

 

[weekender21]

Since its an annual, and supposedly gly kills hawksbeard very well, it's puzzling as to why your earlier treatment didn't clean it up. Often a herbicide failure isn't the fault of the product, but the application. What spray rig do you use?
What planting did you have in the plot before, and what are you planning to grow next?

The ag article I attached above says to add a broadleaf specific herbicide to gly for fall treatment of hawksbeard.

Currently It’s a fall mix of cereal grain, clover, brassica etc. most of the plot is growing excellent and the deer have it at lip level. Previously it was last years fall plot plus volunteer annuals.

Both herbicide applications were from an ATV 26 gallon boom sprayer. The failed control area is probably the easiest area to apply in the entire plot. I only sprayed again two weeks later because the tiny shoots of green from this plant. I thought taller plants blocked herbicide from reaching them during the initial application, apparently not the case.

Everything else in the plot was terminated.

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[weekender21]

Pictures from this weekend.

A bear ripped down my exclusion cage but you can still see how heavy the browse pressure has been.

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[Mennoniteman]

You've definitely got some good grazing their according to that cage, and that's a very nice looking plot.
I read elsewhere that hawksbeard is easy to kill with gly, but glyphosate is always more potent on grasses than it is on broadleafs, so I guess your application not killing it should not be a surprise for me. The 2,4-D should easily handle it, but will kill all of your residual clover, unless you have none. Another one to consider is 2,4-DB, also called Butyrac200, very potent on broadleafs, and doesn't kill grains or clover.

 

[MarkDarvin]

Is this a clay soil? Any chance you've got compaction going on? You've got some kind of condition that's setting the table for that plant to run. It also sounds like it's got a persistent nature to the seed bank, so even if you get it with an application, more seed will activate and fill in. It could also just be a response plant to the glyphosate application.

 

[weekender21]

Is this a clay soil? Any chance you've got compaction going on? You've got some kind of condition that's setting the table for that plant to run. It also sounds like it's got a persistent nature to the seed bank, so even if you get it with an application, more seed will activate and fill in. It could also just be a response plant to the glyphosate application.

Maybe the last one. It’s never been tilled but just started spraying last year. Other stuff has grown in the same spot years past.


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[weekender21]

Update.

Plot hasn’t changed much, hawksbeard is mature and not much else grew in the areas where it had formed thick mats. It would be very hard for a seed to find the ground in those areas.

Overall this plot is in pretty good shape considering the slope, stumps, and lack of real farm equipment.

Hawksbeard

Oxeye

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[Mennoniteman]

Since you don't have the option of tillage you are mostly left with the option of a combination of mowing and applying herbicide. To sort weeds out of clover I've had tremendous success in the past with mowing a plot like yours short during the growing season, waiting several days, then hitting it hard with a herbicide mix like Imazethapr and glyphosate, but wilh the hawksbeard i think I'd try mowing it, then applying a heavy dose of Butyrac200.

 

[dogghr]

Mountain soils are so interesting as you know. I'm thinking to attack with some no N Fert like 0-20-20 with heavy Boron mixed in. Boron can be accessed at dollar general cheap as Borax. Lime to ph correct. Mow every 4-6 wks thru summer to create exposure and trample. As you did, include good dose of AMS with your spraying to include S. We no longer have much acid rain that used to add sulphur to our land. Heavy WR planting in early Sept for a couple years to inhibit weeds and build soils. Of course mixing in clovers and even soil busting brassica. Soils have been waiting a long time for exposure from overstory and will not change over night. Good luck. I feel your pain.

 

[weekender21]

Mountain soils are so interesting as you know. I'm thinking to attack with some no N Fert like 0-20-20 with heavy Boron mixed in. Boron can be accessed at dollar general cheap as Borax. Lime to ph correct. Mow every 4-6 wks thru summer to create exposure and trample. As you did, include good dose of AMS with your spraying to include S. We no longer have much acid rain that used to add sulphur to our land. Heavy WR planting in early Sept for a couple years to inhibit weeds and build soils. Of course mixing in clovers and even soil busting brassica. Soils have been waiting a long time for exposure from overstory and will not change over night. Good luck. I feel your pain.

I’m in compliance with about half of those recommendations but I have not: added synthetic fertilizers, mowed more than once annually, added Boron.

I had hoped that my plots would continue to trend positive, and most have. For some reason parts of this plot have been heading the wrong direction.


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