bullet proof deer! a long night with a bittersweet ending.

[Finnbear]

So last night i shot myself a deer. I didnt set out to, i was after hare with my 222. Then after midnight a buck very similar to one i "missed" a while back appears limping in the moonlight, an obvious lame leg. Thinking for a moment i drop in some expanding bullets and dial my scope for it (i use presets for FMJ and expanding) and decide since its under 100m and iam using a rest the ethical thing would be to finish the job. So i aim behind the front leg and squeeze. No response, i cycle and shoot again, no response, i cycle, pull the shot and the deer flinches and takes off. I wait and go in only to have him take off from a ditch right in front of me. in the brush even my Behemoth of a scope cant catch the moonlight so thats when i hunker down and Google lands me on this forum where i ask for advice, as advised i wait an hour and go in, it was only 30m from me as i had predicted based on my ears and it still crawled away and got up for a final limp groaning and gurgling.... i catch up, put the muzzle to the base of his skull and fire one last time....

upon skinning iam disgusted! i expected to find a single old hole in the leg confirming it was the deer i thought i missed.... instead i find that my shots hit lungs and liver and his hind quarter contained 3 partially healed 22cal holes plus a shattered knee with a little 22lr jammed into the bone! By what kind of ignorance or malice do a total of 4 22 bullets end up in a deers hind quarter?!! Its even more puzzling given how remote i am, iam not aware of anyone else hunting this far inqto the wilderness here as the nearest gov land is 60km away and me and a handfull of other what you might call homesteaders hold exclusive permission to this territory as we all pooled our properties together for us locals.

so this buck took a total of 7 shots in 1-2 weeks Time judging by the healing before finally being put down by the 8th shot to the head... my bullets did in fact expand too. any of you ever run into an animal that tough....

 

[Finnbear]

a moose was also killed last year with a 22lr in its spine wich had healed over. Starting to see a disturbing pattern. Sometimes i wish we had wardens like in the US

 

[swat1018]

Sounds like one of the homesteaders may be a poacher.....

 

[Finnbear]

it does but why use a 22lr, we all have big guns and 22lr isnt even legal for hare here. nobody would look up from hearing a 9.3x62 or 8x57IS going off and we have no wardens around. Not to mention its totally legal to shoot these animals with guns like that. sounds like sadism. Rules are very relaxed out here, no limit on deer, free right to hunt so long as you have permission, and no detailed seasons, if its hubting season its for all game with exeption of some migrating species. No motive to be shooting a 22lr unless you want to be cruel or dont want anyone to notice you (supressors are not regulated here) id like to say il leave it to police but il be realistic, nearest cops are 100km away and only 3 guys strong. They arent coming out to investigate a poacher. It saddens me all the more when someone does this in such a bastion of freedom.

 

[George]

What planet?

G

 

[Finnbear]

What planet?

G

in Finland we call it erämaa, basically "wildland" its areas so thinly populated they are essentially every mans land. There are patches of government land and by some ancient law the direct surroundings of a dwelling are kinda considered private property altho you arent authorised to fence it off or block people from camping, fishing and hiking etc (everymans right law means anything considered "nature" is everymans land) with exeption for hunting wich is the privilege of whoever legally lives there. Ancestral inhabitants of the area are the ones with actual legislative autority over these areas, a bit like native reservations but they still cant prohibit anyone from being in the area, fishing, Gathering berries, camping, hiking hell we have religious cults living in compounds without government intervention(wich i feel is not always a good thing). Ofcourse any legal inhabitant of the area by default has the hunting rights over his surrounding area and by pooling together and renting from the government for a symbolic amount we can create large self governed hunting territories.

Most of this applies countrywide exept there is more competition in the south and therefore stricter local regulation on catch quotas etc. Think of it as Alaska in europe but with 5g internet

 

[Finnbear]

Just one of the shots this deer survived with for over an hour, doesnt seem to have expanded on the heart but the one on the lungs did. Is that something typical of monolithics? i have notoced before how my bullets zip trough musscle and bone but go nuclear on lung or liver tissue.

 

[Mennoniteman]

Just one of the shots this deer survived with for over an hour, doesnt seem to have expanded on the heart but the one on the lungs did. Is that something typical of monolithics? i have notoced before how my bullets zip trough musscle and bone but go nuclear on lung or liver tissue.View attachment 28841

It looks like you need better bullets. The standard hunting bullet in North America is a "pointed soft point" which is a lead bullet in a copper jacket with a tip of lead exposed at the nose, and most other hunting bullets are some type of variation of this. When this bullet hits a deer the lead tip expands as it smashes flat and the copper jacket partially peels back, creating more expansion, and in ideal conditions, the whole chunk stays together in one piece, doing a tremendous amount of damage to a deer's vitals. Looking at that picture of the deer heart with a hole drilled through it, if that had been a "pointed soft point" bullet, only half of the heart would be left, a very normal find when field dressing a deer shot with any average deer cartridge. The first deer I shot broadside through the lungs with a 30-06 40 years ago had a ten foot path of lung material blown out the other side onto the snow, and the deer only went 20 steps further.
With the bullets you have and an accurate rifle I would shoot a deer in the neck, no matter what kind of bullet used, that deer is dead instantly.

 

[Finnbear]

It looks like you need better bullets. The standard hunting bullet in North America is a "pointed soft point" which is a lead bullet in a copper jacket with a tip of lead exposed at the nose, and most other hunting bullets are some type of variation of this. When this bullet hits a deer the lead tip expands as it smashes flat and the copper jacket partially peels back, creating more expansion, and in ideal conditions, the whole chunk stays together in one piece, doing a tremendous amount of damage to a deer's vitals. Looking at that picture of the deer heart with a hole drilled through it, if that had been a "pointed soft point" bullet, only half of the heart would be left, a very normal find when field dressing a deer shot with any average deer cartridge. The first deer I shot broadside through the lungs with a 30-06 40 years ago had a ten foot path of lung material blown out the other side onto the snow, and the deer only went 20 steps further.
With the bullets you have and an accurate rifle I would shoot a deer in the neck, no matter what kind of bullet used, that deer is dead instantly.

i know softpoints. I moved away from them because these monolithics have performed better for me overall and while not illegal yet there is a strong push for lead free.








And this is what i found upon disecting the injured leg. I almost think its buckshot? cant imagine a healthy deer just standing there and taking those hits to the leg or someone putting them that close together in short order.

 

[Finnbear]

The same bullet but in 30-06

 

[RGrizzzz]

What brand are the bullets you're using? Some of the earlier monometal bullets didn't expand well.

 

[Finnbear]

What brand are the bullets you're using? Some of the earlier monometal bullets didn't expand well.

Fox classic hunter. they certainly arent early design. They are very popular with professional stalkers in the UK.

 

[RGrizzzz]

I'm curious if the smaller .222 doesn't expand as well in a solid bullet.

Check out Cutting Edge Bullets Raptor line of solids. They're designed to throw off 6 "petals" to cause more damage.

RAPTOR

Cutting Edge Bullets RAPTOR™ bullets. This line was designed for extreme terminal performance for hunting out to 600yds. Elk, mule deer, white tail, plains game, and varmint hunting will never be the same.

cuttingedgebullets.com

 

[Finnbear]

I'm curious if the smaller .222 doesn't expand as well in a solid bullet.

Check out Cutting Edge Bullets Raptor line of solids. They're designed to throw off 6 "petals" to cause more damage.

its possible, seems counterintuitive given the velocity, however i could imagine the hollowpoint might get plugged up with hair and such more easily. Never had anything but impressive results from the .30 version but the 222 family from Fox is a bit new on the block. They first focussed on 6mm 6.5mm 7mm 7.62mm and 8mm bullets. All of wich have a proven record of being simply amazing. I cant find the Raptor bullets so they likely arent imported. But then again its a moot point since i dont shoot 22 at deer bigger than a dog and even then i take the 30-06 if i know i will be targeting them. 222 is really a small game rifle for me and our roe deer are the biggest small game legally speaking. Exeption being a case like this where an animal is suffering and its the rifle i happen to have in my hands.

Either way not really worth the investment to work up another expanding load for it when its not a deer rifle.

 

[Finnbear]

This is what they do to invasive pests (30-06)