Puzzled by throw and mow

[dogghr]

So this has been the hurdle I can't quite get over with T&M. Most of us include clover in the fall planting for deer nutritional purposes the following spring and summer and for soil health. I'm still new at this, but I've never had the faith to just over seed into clover in the fall without spraying to at least set the clover back. Can you really T&M into established clover without spraying with good results?

No need to set back the clover. I've spread everything from WR to peas to oats into clover with great results. I wouldn't want to set back with spray or mowing my clover especially in the fall. If you want, you can overseed when clover is stressed late summer and not as thick, or late fall when it has been browsed heavy. I overseed either mid Aug to early Nov and usually more so the latter date depending on the weather. . Again if can do before a rain certainly helps. T&M is a bit of a learning curve and you just have to play till you get the hang of it and change expectations of what the field will look like and its pace of growth. Also easier to do no till if severall seasons of rotations have been done to get the soil at more ideal conditions. We are in day 58 with no rain so my plantings not already in ground are on hold.

 

[Osceola]

No need to set back the clover. I've spread everything from WR to peas to oats into clover with great results. I wouldn't want to set back with spray or mowing my clover especially in the fall. If you want, you can overseed when clover is stressed late summer and not as thick, or late fall when it has been browsed heavy. I overseed either mid Aug to early Nov and usually more so the latter date depending on the weather. . Again if can do before a rain certainly helps. T&M is a bit of a learning curve and you just have to play till you get the hang of it and change expectations of what the field will look like and its pace of growth. Also easier to do no till if severall seasons of rotations have been done to get the soil at more ideal conditions. We are in day 58 with no rain so my plantings not already in ground are on hold.

I know you've always been an advocate of over seeding into clover without spraying, dogghr. I had every intention of doing it this year, but I made a couple rookie mistakes and my clover didn't come in good. I had a lot of weeds and bare ground, so I decided to start with a clean slate by spraying. Next year I'll take the leap of faith.

 

[dogghr]

I know you've always been an advocate of over seeding into clover without spraying, dogghr. I had every intention of doing it this year, but I made a couple rookie mistakes and my clover didn't come in good. I had a lot of weeds and bare ground, so I decided to start with a clean slate by spraying. Next year I'll take the leap of faith.

No right or wrong choices, just different options. Honestly I sometimes wonder if I don't till anymore cause I'm too lazy to get out the tiller. I think you choice with the circumstances is not bad option. Good luck.

 

[rlb165]

I did throw n mow with a bunch of grocery store beans last fall: black eye peas, lima beans, black beans, etc. Just like your winter peas I had great germination and the deer loved it (too bad they ate them all in a week).

Catscratch, I actually learned that you could grow grocery store beans when you posted about it last year. (By the way, THANK YOU for that!!)
Pinto beans are now one of my favorite things to plant.

 

[catscratch]

Catscratch, I actually learned that you could grow grocery store beans when you posted about it last year. (By the way, THANK YOU for that!!)
Pinto beans are now one of my favorite things to plant.

Awesome! Glad that helped someone. It doesn't get much easier than going to the grocery store to buy plot seed, and then growing it with TnM.

 

[TreeDaddy]

How are you planting pinto beans?!

bill

 

[catscratch]

How are you planting pinto beans?!

bill

Not sure how rib is doing it but I plant them by throw n mow. In the old days I would have disked a field, spread seed, then ran over it with a springtooth or drag. Either way has worked well for me.

 

[blumsden]

This year, I sprayed waited 3 weeks and the grass was all laid over and it was thick too. I spread my seed into it anyway and then pulled back the thatch and lo and behold most seed made it to the soil. The rains came and washed the rest of the seed to the soil. I didn't bushhog or drag it and they are coming up nicely.

 

[rlb165]

Not sure how rib is doing it but I plant them by throw n mow. In the old days I would have disked a field, spread seed, then ran over it with a springtooth or drag. Either way has worked well for me.

Yes, Throw n' Mow.

 

[Turkish]

This is not meant to criticize the OP in any way……..but this is a good example of why you have to understand the principles and not the method. There’s hundreds of different situations out there that will all have a different combination of variables. You need to be able to assess the situation and then form a short term and long term game plan for how to attack it based on each induvial situation. Good luck with your future plantings srmtrap.

It sounds like you have figured out what, about the OP's strategy, is at fault. I learned not to try this without having terminated plants (either with herbicide or by mowing a winter crop at maturity), but I don't fully understand why it works so much better that why. Why does it?

 

[Smallplot]

One large issue of making throw and mow work is being able to get seeds in contact with the soil. Some fields just are not a good candidate due to their heavy thatch. Before starting take a look at what is under the canopy before mowing, if you see mostly dirt and growing plant stems you are likely going to have a good shot. If not, another method may be better, or you may need additional steps/time for the ground cover to naturally break down.

Once the seeds are on the ground we look at the next puzzle pieces. Moisture and sunlight. Without either the throw and mow is less likely to meet our expectations. As far as canopy there are differences, too thick it blocks out sunlight, too thin and it lets native plants run amuck.

Not that I would ever try to talk someone out of throw and mow, but like every other aspect of food plotting there is a learning curve. Don't put all your eggs in the same basket and be prepared to really look at why something failed for a better experience the next time.


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[DocHolladay]

I had a semi-heavy thatch and the first time, I lightly disked just to make sure. I feel that this fired up the soil microorganisms into eating/decomposing what was laying on the surface(I hope anyway). Since I have done this, I don't have the heavy thatch layer occuring anymore. In the spring when I spread seed for my summer plots and mow the fall plot down, it is thick because of the WW,WO, and AWP and is light in the fall when I spread seed for my fall plots. Almost to the point of me thinking about spreading straw to cover up the seeds. I have half my local plot in milo and millet with weeds mixed in. It will probably be a heavy thatch layer because of the stalk thickness next spring.

I am planning on planting some RW beans and a friend is going to let me use his firminator to plant with, so it will get at least a light disking. It may require a little more, but I will find out once I get started.

 

[catscratch]

I'm all about the thatch. Took a couple of pics yesterday....
The first pic is under the thatch.

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