Merle Hawggard
Well-Known Member
I've been thinking about you and the Texas boys on here the last few days. Glad to hear you're ok. Keep those bucks above water!
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2017 La. bucks
- Thread starter Baker
- Start date
Rough deal for this buck. He has an antler growing out of his eye! I've been watching him most of the summer wondering if/when he would die from this. He also had a 4-5" drop tine near the base of his left side. Not sure when he broke that off.
My best guess is he must have damaged his pedicle last year probably fighting. So a piece of antler grew out through his eye.
My best guess is he must have damaged his pedicle last year probably fighting. So a piece of antler grew out through his eye.
Gravel Road
Well-Known Member
That is amazing. Would certainly make an interesting skull mount.
DocHolladay
Well-Known Member
I think LA is one of those states that people over look for deer. A friend of mine from Oklahoma traveled to LA to visit another friend of ours and to hunt. The guy from OK killed the biggest buck of his life down there and he has killed some pretty big deer in his part of OK. It was big antler wise and body wise too. I think Baker has just up'd the odds in his favor with his management.
Great question I am glad you asked. We do consistently grow 4 yr olds much bigger than the norm for our neighborhood and the state as well. In fact I propose the overall bell curve of our bucks is bigger than the norm both by weight in all age classes as well as antler size by all age class. The interesting question is why.
The short answer is management , including a healthy dose of long term nutrition, grows bucks like that. The conventional wisdom is age, nutrition and genetics. I suggest that it is nutrition, age, and time....as genetics can be shifted over time. Nutrition improves all age classes. I know some believe that the bucks we grow are a result of 2500 acres under game fence. I have learned from personal hands on experience simultaneously managing both fenced and unfenced properties that wire does not grow big deer. Management practices grow big deer. Granted , the more control one can have by whatever means increases the opportunity for improved outcomes.
Unquestionably nutrition has been a big part of our success. While most of our bucks were getting killed prematurely for all the years we were unfenced we were still getting the benefit of the maternal effect from nutrition. Once we fenced the property, we captured the generations of nutrition and the results speak for themselves. Also we had the discipline to let terrific bucks get age on them...some of the bucks were bigger than anything we had ever shot.It was hard to pass them up and crushing when we find some of them dead from fighting and other causes. We also balanced the herd, kept the population well below carrying capacity, and consistently removed some of the mature lessor quality bucks each year .
I don't believe you shift genetics thru harvest. Its not the bucks you remove that make a herd great. It is the ones you leave behind. Still taking out lessor quality bucks helps manage population and shift upward the quality of all remaining bucks. that also leaves the highest quality bucks in the herd a few more years for the breeding they do participate in. It all adds up.
The corollary question here is how does all this effect hunting. Unquestionably the hunting improves as the herd is so much better with more quality bucks and a more natural herd. However, hunting a specific buck is still just as hard as ever. The 'deerness' in them is just as strong as ever and to think they are less wild in any way is simply wrong. The mature bucks have been watching how we move for years and are quite savvy about hunting, hiding and never being seen. Does that get pressured every year become some of the smartest animals on the planet and would challenge the best of us. Of the properties I manage without question the hardest deer to hunt are the mature bucks here on the farm.
DocHolladay
Well-Known Member
How do you diversify the genetics of the herd if you do not let any new deer in? Wouldn't you end of with inbreeding at a certain point? Maybe after 5-10 years or 15-20 years?
Thats another great question. The simple answer lies in the incredible diversity within a group of deer. If you took 100 does and 100 bucks and did the math on genetic diversity the results would be dumbfounding. And we have more deer than that.
Then you add yearling dispersal available for miles on our property and I don't think you ever see any negative genetic effects.
lastly fences do not keep all deer in or out. I've seen yearlings jump an 8' fence flatfooted. There are constant holes being dug underneath and we have seen stretches of our fence 10' under water from flooding. So I do not give any concern for the diversity needs of the herd. So far we have only seen a general trend of improvement.
All that said, I'm 63. I doubt there is any chance of genetic issues in my lifetime if ever. None of my children have the deer bug and it is possible once I'm gone they will sub divide the property or sell it or...In the mean time I'm just gonna enjoy it like a new puppy.
DocHolladay
Well-Known Member
7.5
Good guess Doc. Our best guess is 6 or 7. He's been around a few years.
Heres another old gezzer one of the oldest on the farm at maybe 8 or 9. Very distinct shaped rack though he has gone downhill from his prime. Steve Bartylla and I used to have an ongoing debate about when a buck is in his prime. For this buck it was probably 5 or 6. He was a very balanced 10 pt then, Still cool though reclusive and rarely seen.
Heres another old gezzer one of the oldest on the farm at maybe 8 or 9. Very distinct shaped rack though he has gone downhill from his prime. Steve Bartylla and I used to have an ongoing debate about when a buck is in his prime. For this buck it was probably 5 or 6. He was a very balanced 10 pt then, Still cool though reclusive and rarely seen.
