Own your Own Whitetail land, but also go on guided, out of state hunts?

Curious how many people out there own their own piece of dirt that they manage for whitetails, but also go (whether annually or every few years) on guided hunts? What other types of guided hunts do you go on....also whitetail, or different species alltogether? If whitetail, why do you do that? Do you ever struggle with the amount of time or money you spend on either, taking away from the full potential of the other? If you have been doing this for a long time, what advice would you give to other people who try to do both?

Stonewall said:

Curious how many people out there own their own piece of dirt that they manage for whitetails, but also go (whether annually or every few years) on guided hunts? What other types of guided hunts do you go on....also whitetail, or different species alltogether? If whitetail, why do you do that? Do you ever struggle with the amount of time or money you spend on either, taking away from the full potential of the other? If you have been doing this for a long time, what advice would you give to other people who try to do both?

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My wife and I own 90 acres that we live on and another 25 acres where I grew up. Both have deer with this 90 we live on having some very large deer and our 25 is loaded with younger bucks and does. We got our 90 nearly 6 years ago and my parents gave me 10 acres of the family farm and then when my father passed my mother gave me another connected 15 acres. I have had a deer lease since 1997 of 1500 acres with several of my friends and my wife. We have taken a couple nice deer off our original 10 but that is the exception and not the rule. We were able to take a few nice deer off our deer lease over the years but not many that had “wow” factor. Our 90 is producing several very nice deer and this year our lease just hasn’t had much going on. I have found that when I find a deer using our place that is something special I really don’t want to go to our lease for fear of punching a tag on a lesser deer but a very, very good deer for that area. Over the last 2 trips to our lease I have taken 2 ladder stands down and brought them home. Not sure if I am going to spend the money on it in the future even though I love the camp and the folks and even the deer hunting but I keep thinking what I could do with that money on our owned properties...

As far as a guided hunt...no interest...

I have done Canadian whitetail hunts in the upper forest section of Saskatchewan. Love that area and its extreme remoteness. Hard hunting with all day sits in subzero temps at times. My goal is in next couple years to make final trip to Yukon for a moose kill with the recurve. That will be my last I think. I'd like to do an Alaskan bowhunt for Griz but I'm afraid I've lost too much testosterone to make that happen. I never regret money I spend on hunting anywhere, I know some who spend that much on Strippers and/or gambling in a year, so not a problem for me to spend money on hobby I choose..

dogghr said:

I have done Canadian whitetail hunts in the upper forest section of Saskatchewan. Love that area and its extreme remoteness. Hard hunting with all day sits in subzero temps at times. My goal is in next couple years to make final trip to Yukon for a moose kill with the recurve. That will be my last I think. I'd like to do an Alaskan bowhunt for Griz but I'm afraid I've lost too much testosterone to make that happen. I never regret money I spend on hunting anywhere, I know some who spend that much on Strippers and/or gambling in a year, so not a problem for me to spend money on hobby I choose..

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Some of us are turned different. I care not a whit about strippers or gambling nor do I consider a guided or placed whitetail hunt but if I was to be able to spend a few bucks and go somewhere I could just throw a hang on stand on my back and do my own setup on world class proven ground I would be more apt to do that. When I first got on our lease it was because I had no ground left to hunt other than my families 50 acres or public ground. The lease started off at $500 year and you got to do any hunting you liked and you can bring a child up to the age of 16 at no cost as long as you hunt right with them. It has now just about tripled in cost and with my wife and I both on it I am looking at what we could do with that time 3k plus the money I spend fixing roads, brushhogging, etc...

I do put in for draw hunts here in Oklahoma because I get drawn in I am on my own just like I like it. Don’t like sitting where someone else sat all the week before...

I’ve done a few guided hunts, (or maybe I should call them “outfitted” hunts), most of them weren’t successful if your definition of success is bringing home a cooler full of meat. In my mind though, only one wasn’t successful, in that the outfitter was a complete fraud.

One mulie hunt was in Eastern Colorado and the hunt was great, but no deer were harmed by me. We had a camp cook who was a veteran cook of cow camps, mining camps, and hunting camps. Every morning as soon as I heard the first clink of utensils from the cook/dining tent I dressed and went over. That usually gave us about an hour to visit before the others straggled in. He was great to talk with, and man, could he cook ! Good food and plenty of it, wall tents to sleep in, mid twenties at night, the Purgatorie River, (think small Grand Canyon), what more could you want ? (I mean besides a 30” mulie buck)

The other mulie hunt in Montana was successful meat wise, but much less enjoyable. The old fart outfitter was a grouch, wanted us to kill the first one we saw, and bitched when we both wanted to get my buck to town and get him in cold storage instead of hunting until dark with the buck in the back of a Yukon My buddy and I had come to this agreement beforehand because we both were after meat as well as a trophy. We flipped for first shot, he won and wanted me to go first. I took home a 163” mule deer buck but the other trip was much more fun. He scored the next day on a buck we had to follow for about a mile before we could cut him off. I was a little younger then but I had a twisted foot from an earlier quail hunt and I was miserable. We got it done though and those memories are what CAN be the reward of an outfitted or guided hunt.

All of my archery antelope hunts have been miserable and fun. Miserable in a popup blind in 90* heat or 40* and misting rain, (Wyoming offers both) ! Forty mph winds, thinking your blind is gonna be airborne any second, or sultry heat for two days while the goats are shunning the new blob on their waterhole. Then, in just a few minutes it all turns around, a good goat comes to water and your arrow flies true ! Can’t beat that with a stick !

While I enjoy whitetail hunting, the out of state hunts I’ve been on just add to my memories, some good, some not so good. I choose to remember the good ones !

I will say, traveling to Canada these days is a PIA if you are taking a firearm. Not only that, but on our last trip they got our weapons into Saskatoon but didn't bother to ship our clothing till the next day. Keep in mind this is mid Nov and it ain't summer. There were 7 of us friends that went booking the max for the trip. Out of Saskatoon, it is a 2 hour drive to the north woods where they had a crazy 20000 something sq miles leased for the 7 hunters of us. That's about third the size of OK. It was a 30 min drive from camp to access road then 20 min ride into your stand on atv. Left at stand before dark, and picked up after dark. Popup blind with decent old house seat and cushions, no heat. I still have the Cabelas cold wear stuff even tho its been 10 years since last trip. Booties and hand warmers stuffed everywhere. And heater body suit. No scents were allowed. I shot my deer at 15 below zero.
We stayed in an old Curling alley building. Nothing fancy but comfortable. A lady much crippled by arthritis was the cook and she was amazing . Breakfast was ready at 4 and she had big lunches ready full of sandwiches and snacks to take, and if you had your own thermos she had it filled. I always take hot chocolate which she did for me as it doesn't make you pee and has as much caffeine as coffee. Dinner was waiting when returned late and it was as good as any home cooking. Again all crowded around the table sharing days stories.
First day I saw 8, ten point or better shooter bucks but was holding for something special. Second day by 10 I had seen another half dozen and had just agonized over a magnificent 10 ptr with a doe. I let him walk and began to regret it. So I doe bleated a few times hoping he'd come back and let me look again. I leaned back, opened a granola bar and poured cup chocolate. In the thick brush I could see 2 long tines standing wide in the brush, had no idea what he looked like but I knew I would shoot him if given the chance. He wouldn't clear the brush, but the other bucks had shown me a path they were using and I took a guess he would exit thru there and I got ready. Needless to say my hunt was over at 10 on the second day. I radioed in with our given walkie talkies but had no signal. Finally got thru and they came and we hauled him back to dress and butcher.
Thru 2 days I was the only one seeing decent bucks, and being the only bowhunter of the group I tried to explain to those hard headed gunhunters that most those bucks responded to the bleat and they were welcome to take my grunt call with them. Too stubborn. Two other deer were shot by end of week, one a basket rack buck and another ok 10 pt, neither of which I would've wasted my time.
I became good friends with the outfitters and actually spent the next 3 days helping one of them set traps for wolves , beaver, etc. I think of myself as a reliable mountain survival man, but this dude 10 years older was a machine. He ran a 30 mile trap line and we were in back country that I cannot describe. We have wilderness areas in WV where even air travel or cell service is banned but it pales to the millions of acres of that country. The other outfitter had just lost his brother who was a champion bull rider, in an airplane crash. My sympathy and so called words of wisdom for him have come back to be a hard pill to swallow for me in these last couple months. I've stayed in contact with the mountain man over the years.
Not only is this a great area to hunt, but the people of the area are on hard times, and our little week of monetary spending served a great cause. I donated my deer meat to a needy family that had little income due to job loss. And honestly, the airlines had changed that year and had become at that time anti hunting, and really made things difficult to bring back stuff from the area to the states.
It was a great experience with some good friends and very glad I did it. Cost was about 5000$ plus a license which I can't remember how much that year. Would highly recommend it for those that don't want soft. I hope that Yukon hunt will happen for me before that happens.
Only drawback of the trip was by the end of the week, if I had to hear "eh?" at the end of sentence one more time, I was going postal. JK

I love chasing whitetails at home, but I would like to start an out west elk trip every three or so years. I’ve got some buddies that are on board and we would do DIY.

I also have an Alaskan moose hunt on the list and have been looking hard at the DIY drop in spike camps. Planning to do that hunt in the next five years. I have a lot of reading/planning to do.

I go on a guided trip most years in addition to chasing WT around on our place. I like chasing mule deer and elk, and TX pigs and white tails. The truth is, I love to hunt, see new country and looking for another great experience/memory. These get aways are what makes putting up with the Gotham bearable.

I think I can explain by a MT trip I just got back from. I’ve hunted with this guide since 2004. He’s a riot to be around and is as hard working/easy going as anyone I know. He’s passionate about managing properties. The ranch we hunted is one of my favorites. 40,000+ acres in the eastern MT badlands. First morning we spotted a big heavy non-typical. I never had a shot or saw him a second time, but passed a high 180s typical and a half dozen 160-170” bucks while looking for him. I ended up never firing a shot and it was still the best hunt I’ve been on in years. I passed a number of deer I’d happily shot 5 years ago. it was spot and stalk hunting at its best, with many deer spotted at a mile or two. It was relaxing, thrilling, and full of anticipation. The scenery was breathtaking, and sunsets/sunrises were perfect. We saw hundreds of deer, dozens of coyotes and even reduced the prairie dog population with my 300wby. The comradely I shared with a good friend made it a true treat. Was I sad I didn’t fill my tag? Not at all. Anymore, my lust for the chase is greater than the desire to punch a tag.

Was it better than hunting my own property? No, it’s just very very different with its own rewards, different scenery and different critters with different patterns.

I own two farms and lease around 2000 acres in Oklahoma. I also hunt out of state every other year for either mule deer or elk. I don’t regret spending the cash to make memories with my family and friends. My out of state hunts are all diy type and I have purchased my own wall tent and camping gear. Just got back from hunting Mule deer in Montana. Great time with my son and a friend, looking forward to our next adventure. Spend the cash and enjoy the hunt while your young, old age will be here soon enough!


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Great question, and can lead to a great exercise.

What do our hobbies cost, and what are we missing out on by doing things the way we do?

...there's more coming. Had a premature posting...

Not guided but I've done quite a bit of hunting out west for elk, deer, turkeys and pronghorn. I've also made a few trips to AK, two for deer and one for moose. It's all about the adventure for me, I'll never own enough property to keep me contained.

A person has to figure out what something really costs. What is the opportunity cost of what you've got sunk into land and equipment, and the costs of using it and getting to it (gas, property tax, electric, maintenance, insurance etc).

I assume I can make 8% on alternative investments (don't get hung up on the 8%). If I have $100,000 in hunting land and buildings, that's $8,000/year opportunity cost of that capital.

$8,000 opportunity cost
$1,700 land loan interest
$750 gas to go there each year
$350 property tax
$125 propane
$200 food plot supplies
= $11,125 / year opportunity cost

If I didn't have my land, what else could I do with that money? Truth is, I have no idea what I'd do for fun or what to do with my free time. It is very important for me to always have my own place, because I spent 20 years hoping and begging for a place to hunt, only to have all those places I loved go away for one reason or another. My land is nothing spectacular. It's almost laughable for expectations, and I still love it, because it's mine and nobody holds the cards over my head. So I am fine with that opportunity cost.

Now fishing, I love fishing, but I won't own a big water worthy boat, or a truck worthy of reliably pulling it 600 miles round trip. You're talking another $60,000-$100,000 just to chase fish, and for how many days a year for a working man?

$8,000 opportunity cost
$8,000 depreciation
$1,500 insurance (wild guess there)
$2,000 fuel
$1,000 tires
$1,500 lodging
= $22,000 opportunity cost to fish (divided by how many fishing days per year?)
You gotta fish a lotta damn days to out-pencil the benefit of just writing a check to an outfitter who's got all the gear and equipment. Throw a $35,000 fish house in there with a broken axel in a remote area every three years, and it's a money pit.

I'll gladly write a check to a fishing guide, ice fishing outfitter, or hunting guide for those experiences I only desire to do once in a while.

Know your opportunity cost.

This is a big reason I push so hard to figure out how to get the most outta my food plots with the least amount of work, money, equipment, fertilizer, seed, and chemical. I bet I don't have $600 in habitat tools right now. Most of that is my chainsaw and leaf blower. Beyond that, I rent some stuff each year. I will end up with a wheeler and fancy mower at some point, but my land tools won't top $10,000 total.

What some of our intellectual betters on the TV shows show us, is that it takes $80,000 in implements to grow mega boner magic beans. If you got the juice and it's not a big deal, rock on brother. That was the point of being successful. But for the guys in the middle that could benefit from an internal audit, it's a worthwhile study.

MarkDarvin said:

This is a big reason I push so hard to figure out how to get the most outta my food plots with the least amount of work, money, equipment, fertilizer, seed, and chemical. I bet I don't have $600 in habitat tools right now. Most of that is my chainsaw and leaf blower. Beyond that, I rent some stuff each year. I will end up with a wheeler and fancy mower at some point, but my land tools won't top $10,000 total.

What some of our intellectual betters on the TV shows show us, is that it takes $80,000 in implements to grow mega boner magic beans. If you got the juice and it's not a big deal, rock on brother. That was the point of being successful. But for the guys in the middle that could benefit from an internal audit, it's a worthwhile study.

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.......and just where can i buy some mega boner magic beans?

bill

Great questions and one I've thought about many times. I get invited to go to KS and IL to chase whitetails. Good friends own land in both places. Oddly enough, I'd rather hunt my own land and chase the occasional 3.5 yr old and the rare 4.5 yr old that might make it through a hunting season down here. This past February, I purchased 56 acres near my son and daughter that we are about to break ground on our retirement home. Area is much more populated and loaded with deer. My son killed his oldest buck off the new property a few weeks ago. It's loaded with deer. I've yet to hunt it for some odd reason. I've put so much sweat equity into the Triple C and have so many memories of great sits and family gatherings with a few nice deer taken that I just don't care to hunt anywhere else. I'm sure that will change when we finish our home and move in but I think I will always prefer hunting where it all started.

This past Saturday, I was the only one hunting the farm Saturday morning. It was perfect conditions to still hunt following rain the night before and a steady 8 mph NE wind. I headed to the area we call the swamp, really more of a bottom land hardwood area bordering our south border creek and interspersed with a few beaver ponds and sloughs. I walked places I have never been before as we seldom go in to this area. And while slipping along, I often looked around and thought how fortunate I am to be able to call this place my own.

Triple C said:

Great questions and one I've thought about many times. I get invited to go to KS and IL to chase whitetails. Good friends own land in both places. Oddly enough, I'd rather hunt my own land and chase the occasional 3.5 yr old and the rare 4.5 yr old that might make it through a hunting season down here. This past February, I purchased 56 acres near my son and daughter that we are about to break ground on our retirement home. Area is much more populated and loaded with deer. My son killed his oldest buck off the new property a few weeks ago. It's loaded with deer. I've yet to hunt it for some odd reason. I've put so much sweat equity into the Triple C and have so many memories of great sits and family gatherings with a few nice deer taken that I just don't care to hunt anywhere else. I'm sure that will change when we finish our home and move in but I think I will always prefer hunting where it all started.

This past Saturday, I was the only one hunting the farm Saturday morning. It was perfect conditions to still hunt following rain the night before and a steady 8 mph NE wind. I headed to the area we call the swamp, really more of a bottom land hardwood area bordering our south border creek and interspersed with a few beaver ponds and sloughs. I walked places I have never been before as we seldom go in to this area. And while slipping along, I often looked around and thought how fortunate I am to be able to call this place my own.

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That’s kind of the way I feel. I still go and hunt our deer lease some to justify the cost on south wind days but when that wind switches I am out of there!!!

I am the same as most of y’all. I have no desire to hunt someone else’s land for deer. I work on two properties around here year round so that I can enjoy them during hunting season - why would I want to go somewhere else? Plus, I don’t think whitetail deer hunting is particularly hard the way we do it. Sitting in a tree or a box waiting for a deer to walk by doesn’t take great skill. I enjoy the habitat work and growing big deer. Killing them provides venison but it’s no longer the driving factor.

I do greatly enjoy traveling to Canada every year to hunt waterfowl (no guides) and New Zealand to hunt red stags (no guides and on public land).

Yeah, I have been building points in Iowa and have 5 now, but if I am going to take a week off of work and go hunt somewhere out of state, I want it to be for elk or some other western/up north (Canada/Alaska) pursuit. I don't know if I will ever use those Iowa points. I'd rather go for a sheep if I am lucky enough to draw, or even DIY elk in an OTC area.......as others have said, to see and experience new things. I think also after doing some western hunting, you don't look at deer hunting the same way anymore.

A good friend owns about 600 acres near me, and his family spends alot of time and money with feeders, plots, etc.....but as we speak he is in Texas with his whole family hunting a ranch, killing hogs and kids first deer, etc. Eating and drinking by the fire pit and living the life. He didn't say this to me, but I think there is something about going somewhere and having no worries...tresspassers, are my guests having fun, a broken toilet in the house, a tree that fell over the road, etc ....whatever. It is just nice to go somewhere I think, and be the guest that does nothing but have fun, and lets someone else worry. In that way, I can definitely understand wanting to go hunt whitetails somewhere else.

None for me. Hunting NY now, public land southern zone. All I can think about is two more nights and I'll be home. There's no place like home.